Cream of the Crop 1/Cream of the Crop 1.iso/RELIGION/OB_92.ARJ/04-26-92

Text File | 1992-05-06 | 145KB | 3,056 lines

Date       04-18-92 08:03:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Gary Johnson
Subject     GOD TOLD ME

 GJ>  Terry, what I beleive is found in the Bible.

 That is the EXACT same thing the scribes and pharisees said to Jesus
 when they accused him of breaking the laws of Moses.  You are doing
 EXACTLY what they did.

 GJ> And the scribes
 GJ> and pharisees were the ones who kept adding to the law of Moses
 GJ> (Found in the Bible) and they made THEIR additions MORE
 GJ> important THAN the Law of Moses.So I have a hard time seeing
 GJ> what your point is here.

 Points like the rapture theory, trinity, failure to recognize the fall
 of man involved sin of a sexual nature. AND MOST important of all,
 failing to recognize man's portion of responsibility.

 GJ> And tell me Terry, WHAT is MORE sound
 GJ> than the Doctrine taught in the Bible?

 It is MUCH MORE sound to have God's view and interpret the doctrines
 correctly.  That is why Jesus appeared to Rev. Moon and gave him several
 revelations.

 GJ> From my perspective
 GJ> NOTHING is more sound than what is taught in the scripture. Do
 GJ> you agree with this?

 Yes, I agree that the mistranslation of doctrines taught in scripture is
 the reason Christianity is divided and powerless.  We don't need another
 human interpretation. We need a revelation from God to straighten out
 this mess.  That is why Jesus appeared to Rev. Moon. Until you pray you
 will not understand what I'm telling you.

 GJ> Whoah we are not talking about what I beleive. What we are
 GJ> talking about is what appears to be an attack on Biblical
 GJ> doctrine. I stand on what the Bible teaches, not what is newest
 GJ> doctrine.

 That attitude and excuse was EXACTLY the same one that was used by the
 people who MURDERED Jesus.  You would have joined those who MURDER
 Christ had you been there  2,000  years ago.

 GJ> And as far as the work of Christ on the cross, I believe itit is
 GJ> God's will that all men be SAVED from punishment, and that
 GJ> Christ, through his work, through his blood being shed
 GJ> accomplished just that. He took on the full brunt
 GJ> of God's righteous wrath, that whoever would believe in Jesus
 GJ> Christ and accept him as Lord and Saviour WILL be saved.

 That's nice but where do you stand on the issue of MURDERING him.  Are
 you a Christ KILLER too?  I firmly believe you would have supported the
 crucifixion of Christ.  Jesus Christ came in 1935 and anointed Rev. Moon
 with a mission to carry out his work and establish the kingdom of God on
 earth and thus far you have only opposed Jesus' appointee.  How do you
 reckon Jesus feels about you now?

 LUK 13:27   But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are;
 depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

 GJ> And why should I pray on something I already know to be true.

 Ahhh  haaa !   There it is right there.  You think you already know...
 the famous last words... the most dangerous last words and attitude the
 world has seen.  You presume to second guess God.  You SHOULD read the
 scripture and believe it:

 MAT 25:13   Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour
 wherein the Son of man cometh.

 MAL 4:1     For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and
 all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the
 day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it
 shall leave them neither root nor branch.

 GJ> Something that
 GJ> the Holy Spirit has Already made abundantly clear to me? That
 GJ> would be like praying to God about whether polygamy was right?
 GJ> It is obvious to me that the Bible is the truth, and I believe
 GJ> the truth.


 The question between us has NEVER been involved the truthfulness of the
 Bible, it has ALWAYS been about your interpretation of the Bible.  That
 is where the problem lies.

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Date       04-18-92 12:47:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Carla Rygula
Subject          GOOD NEWS!

 CR> >  Give me a break.  No one believes you are cruel and heartless
 CR> > because
 CR> >  you are obeying God's law, we believe you are misguide
 CR>
 CR>
 CR> Since when were you given authority to speak for others

 The same day when you were given authority to say:

 "CR> Often times people imagine that Jehovah's Witnesses are cruel"

 CR> Little do they know that we DO accept transfusions.

 I give you credit to be big enough to admit your mistake and change...
 welcome into the fold on this matter.

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Date       04-18-92 12:51:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Mike Barefield
Subject    HEAVEN

 MB> The third heaven is an actual place.  It is not just the earths
 MB> atmosphere or "space".  It is described in many places in the
 MB> Bible.  I will list a few.

 Thanks.  The third heaven is not a planet, it is a realm of the
 spiritual  world, like paradise is a level and hell is a level.  You
 don't understand that your spirit grows and develops according to the
 vitality elements it receives from your physical body.  When you lose
 your physical body you are stuck at that level and you enter the
 spiritual world at that level -- with NO quantum leap to another level,
 UP or DOWN.  You have much to learn about the spiritual world and so do
 I. If we are close minded, we won't learn.

 MB> How art thou fallen from HEAVEN, O Lucifer, son of the morning!
 MB> How art thou cut down to the ground, chich didst weaken the
 MB> nations.  For thou has said in thine hear, I will ascend into
 MB> HEAVEN, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God.  I will
 MB> sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the "sides of
 MB> the north".

 This is a typical example of how the Bible uses earth and heaven to
 connote living either in the presence or absence of God's love.   Earth,
 and waters is symbolic for the fallen world, while Heaven and clouds are
 symbolic for the purified, resurrected world.

 MB> Terry, Heaven is a planet.  When God made Heaven and Earth He
 MB> made them the same - planets.  There was no Heaven until He
 MB> created it. And His entire creation is after the same pattern.
 MB> The old and new testament are full of passages, showing that the
 MB> earth is a "pattern" of the heavenly original.

 If this is true then we don't need Jesus to take us to heaven, we can
 get there through science and technology.   Do you really think we can
 get into a spaceship and fly there?  Maybe you do?  How much have you
 been watching Star Trek? <grin>   Such a concept is highly illogical
 because even if we changed our location and went there we would still
 fight, quarrel and sin. Heaven is not a planet it is a state of
 existence where the hearts of individuals and families have been
 restored. It is a realm of existence where people experience the true
 love of God.  God's love can be experienced just as deeply here on
 planet earth as it can anywhere in the solar system.  We need to give
 and receive true love. We can get there by going to the Moon  --- Rev.
 Moon that is.

 > Think about it.

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Date       04-18-92 13:18:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Lord Loki
Subject     Mind-Control and LogLo

 LL> Obviously, I hit a "nerve", Terry because I was not specifically
 LL> referring to your "cult"!  But, since you fired back...

 Looks like I was the one who hit the nerve!  I just commented on your
 message to all to give you another view to think about... then you blew
 up.  If you don't like folks to respond to your messages it may be wise
 to keep them on your own drive... cause when they hit mine they are fair
 game!

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Date       04-18-92 13:30:00
From       Terry Blount
To         John Williams
Subject     QUALIFICATION TO BE BE B

 JW> You are secure in your belief that you will go to heaven.

 You don't understand my faith.  When we die we go to the same level of
 spiritual world as the level of maturity we have attained during out
 life on earth.  I don't claim to be so high.

 JW>  If rev. Moon suits you, fine by me.  But don't tell me
 JW> "okay, I have mine, go get yours, you swine."

 Just relax.  Your imagination is running away.

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Date       04-18-92 13:51:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Mike Barefield
Subject        QUALIFICATION TO TO B

 MB> None.  Jesus didn't tell him, Satan did.  Jesus would have been
 MB> lying, not longer sinless, no longer a valid savior.

 MAT 12:24   But when the Pharisees heard [it], they said, This [fellow]
 doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.

 MAR 3:22     And the scribes which came down from Jerusalem said, He
 hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth he out devils.

 MB> Terry, God didn't change is mind and set up Moon.  Satan set up MB>

 Moon.  I am sorry if it sounds harsh.  But you need the truth.

 Well it is strange that two people can have such an opposite opinion
 about someone.  Either Rev. Moon is of God or of the devil.  I can
 remember the last time people were so divided.

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Date       04-19-92 09:29:00
From       Terry Blount
To         John Williams
Subject      God told me

 JW> No, Terry.  Just because God "allows" me to have an opinion
 JW> doesn't make it correct.

 Well, see there, you learned something from a Moonie.  Until now it
 appeared that you thought you were correct about everything in the
 world.

 JW> I am just allowed to make an opinion.
 JW> If you could clear that red
 JW> haze over your eyes and read you would see that.

 Since you realize you may not ALWAYS be correct you may want to re-
 evaluate that statement.

 JW> On a spiritual level, of course.  You writing is usually laced
 JW> with threats about what will happen to those who do not follow
 JW> Rev. Moon, what will happen to those who scoff at Rev. Moon.

 Can you possibly dream up a scenario worse than rejecting the second
 coming of Christ?   That is the #1 thing every Christian should be
 praying to avoid. Thinking one knows it all is EXACTLY the same kind of
 excuse the people have who nailed Jesus Christ to the cross.

 JW> And you yourself are an
 JW> insulting person, especialy when one is trying to discuss
 JW> something.

 If you and I were not fervent, ardent and excited about our beliefs we
 would be outside playing frezby... or something.  Being zealous is my
 only crime.  If you perceive it to be insulting, I probably need to tone
 it down.  But if I did not rile you up you would not be responding now.

 JW> What I write is only responded
 JW> to by hate and sarcasam.  Once again, I see you as a
 JW> representitive of Rev.
 JW> Moon's crown, and my attitude of them iis formed through you.
 JW> You are not forming a good one.

 Well go to the Unification Church and find a hero.  Right now I'm
 probably the only avenue you have to find the truth about Rev. Moon.
 You can kill the messenger because you don't like his breath or you can
 get the news.   It is easy to find fault in me but will that benefit
 you?


 MAT 7:5      Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own
 eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy
 brother's eye.

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Date       04-19-92 09:51:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject      GREETINGS

 ND>  Terry, the name written on the white stone referred to in D&C
 ND> 130:11 is the
 ND> heavenly name of the person who recieves it, not another name
 ND> for another Christ (SMM).

 How can you be sure about that?

 You should be looking forward to such an event:

 NE2 20:26 And the Lord of Hosts shall stir up a scourge for him
 according to the slaughter of Midian at the rock of Oreb; and as his rod
 was upon the sea so sha ll he lift it up after the manner of Egypt. And
 it shall come to pass in that day that his burden shall be taken a way
 from off thy shoulder, and his yoke from off thy neck, and the yoke
 shall be destroyed because of the anointing.


 Maybe you should have a talk with your leader?

 D&C 68:21 But, by virtue of the decree concerning their right of the
 priesthood descending from father to son, they may claim their anointing
 if at any time they can prove their lineage, or do ascertain it by
 revelation from the Lord under the hands of the above named Presidency.

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Date       04-19-92 10:02:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject            WITNESSING

 ND>      Terry, I am concerned about something. When you say that
 ND> the body of Jesus
 ND> Christ was taken away by a cloud of unbelievers.

 I don't think I said that.  Maybe someone is entering messages under my
 name? <grin>   That is not my position.  I believe that Jesus' PHYSICAL
 body as taken care of by his FOLLOWERS. It was Jesus' immortal spiritual
 body that was appearing during the 40 days after his crucifixion.


 ND> So are you
 ND> saying that the ressurected body of Jesus Christ could die?

 The spiritual body of no man or woman can die.  The spirit in in the
 image of God... ETERNAL.  The question we should be concerned about is
 the development of our spiritual man.  Can we follow Jesus example and
 mature our spirit man or shall we go the way of the world and cause it
 to be polluted and deformed in to a hideous creature?  Those are the
 options.  And that is what we will be living with for a very long time
 once we pass from this world.

 ND>     I would never take the life of any man, including Sun Myung
 ND> Moon, but has he taught that he had an immortal body? Of course,
 ND> the next question is optional pertaining to the answer of the
 ND> 1st two. How many times did Jesus die?

 Jesus' physical body was killed once.  His spiritual body was never
 killed. It is impossible to kill one's spiritual body.  BUT the Bible
 often talks of spiritual death because living in the absence of God's
 love is a state of spiritual death.

 Life and death in Biblical terms can be confusing.  Sometimes death can
 mean physical death and other times death can mean living outside the
 realm of God's love and dominion.  Jesus said people attending the
 funeral were dead:

 LUK 9:60    Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go
 thou and preach the kingdom of God.

 You need the foundation of the principles of creation to understand my
 views on this sprit/flesh subject.   Let me post you about 3 or 4
 messages and you read them carefully and ask questions or explain how
 your views differ.

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Date       04-19-92 10:16:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject            WITNESSING

 ND>      Terry, I am concerned about something.
                           The Spiritual World

 It is very important for our life of faith that we correctly understand
 the issues concerning life after death and man's spirit self.  Let us
 examine these questions: Does man have a spirit self? If so, what does
 it look like?  What is the spirit world like?  What is the relationship
 of the spirit world to the physical world?  What principles govern the
 spirit world?

 Much information is being collected these days in relation to the spirit
 world.  However, it does not seem possible to explain systematically or
 to understand clearly these apparently complex phenomena.  As a result,
 the important questions mentioned above have confused and even dismayed
 many people, and this has affected their religious lives.  Some logical
 explanation is necessary for the many descriptions of a spirit world
 that appear in the Bible, such as the three stages of the spirit world
 mentioned in 2 Corinthians 12:2, the appearance of Moses and Elijah with
 Jesus on the mount of the Transfiguration, and the many examples
 concerning heaven that are recorded in the Book of Revelation.

 The Creation is not composed of only the Visible Substantial World,
 which may be compared with the human body; it also consists of the
 Invisible Substantial World, which may be compared with the human mind.
 We can understand the relationship between these two worlds by
 considering the relationship between mind and body.  Our physical body
 is limited by time; it cannot transcend the present moment.  Our
 physical body is limited by time; it cannot transcend the present
 moment.  Our physical body is a being of the moment; it eventually
 becomes old and returns to the soil.  Our mind is not limited by time;
 no barrier of time can stop it.  It can freely reflect on the past and
 long for the future, if it wishes to do so; it is eternal.

 The physical body is also limited by space.  It occupies a specific
 place at each moment and cannot be in another place at the same time.
 The mind, however, is not limited by space.  The mind does not leave any
 visible traces in the world of space and can exist in any place, if it
 desires to.  The mind is so limitless that it can embrace the universe,
 if it expands its dimensions.

 So, man consists of a body, which is limited and transitory, and a mind
 which is limitless and eternal.  The sphere of action for the limited,
 transitory body is the Visible Substantial World, and the sphere of
 action for the limitless, eternal mind is the Invisible Substantial
 World.  Just as man's mind is subject and motivator of the body, the
 Invisible Substantial World is subject and motivator of the Visible
 Substantial World (Heb 8:5).

                    The Position of Man in the Cosmos

 The what is man's relationship to these two worlds?  In Genesis 2:7, it
 says, "...the Lord God formed man of dust from the ground..." which
 means that God created man's physical self with the basic elements of
 the Visible Substantial World.  That God "...breathed into his nostrils
 the breath of life" (Gen 2:7) means that he fashion man's spirit out of
 the basic elements of the spirit world to form what in The Principle is
 called the spirit self.

 The position of man in the cosmos is as follows.  First of all God
 planned man as the microcosm of the cosmos.  God created the cosmos
 first, but he created it based on the pattern of the Internal Chatacter
 and the External Form of the ideal human being, whom he planned to
 create later. Man's spirit self is an encapsulation of the Invisible
 Substantial World, and his physical body is an encapsulation of the
 Visible Substantial World.  God mad man as the microcosm of both the
 Invisible and the Visible Substantial Worlds.  So man is called a
 microcosm.

 Secondly, God created man to be the ruler of both realms of the cosmos
 (Gen 1:28, 1 Cor 6:3).  To put it another way, God created man's
 physical self from the elements that make up the physical world and gave
 man dominion over the physical world through his five physical senses.
 Similarly, God created the spirit self from the elements that make up
 the spirit world and gave man dominion over the spirit world through his
 five spiritual senses.  Man was originally created with two sets of five
 senses, one for the physical self and the other for the spirit self.  As
 a result of the Fall, man's five spiritual senses became dulled and man
 became unable to perceive the spirit world, which can be perceived only
 by the spirit mind and spirit body.  Those whose spiritual senses have
 been restored by God's grace and a religious life can experience this
 world, either partially or completely (the Book of Revelation, 2 Cor
 12:2, the Transfiguration (Mt 17:2)).

 Thirdly, God created man to be the medium of interaction and the center
 for the harmony of the Creation.  The spirit world and physical world
 cannot communicate directly with each other.  When man's physical self
 and spirit self become one through Give and Take Action, the physical
 world and the spirit world can communicate with one another through man.

 From what has been said above, we can summarize man's position in the
 Creation as follow: man is the microcosm of the spirit world and the
 physical world; he was created to be the ruler of these two worlds; and
 he is the center for the harmony of these two worlds.  However because
 of man's Fall, the Creation lost its ruler and center of harmony, Thus,
 ...the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons
 of God;...because the creation itself will be set free from its bondage
 to decay and obtain the glorious liberty of the children of God.  We
 know that the whole creation has been groaning in travail together until
 now.... (Rom 8:19-23)

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Date       04-19-92 10:17:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject            WITNESSING

 ND>      Terry, I am concerned about something.
      The Relationship between the Spirit Self and the Physical Self

 The physical self consists of the physical mind and the physical body.
 The physical mind is the subject part of the physical self, controlling
 the physiological functions of existence, reproduction, and action. Thus
 the physical mind is similar to an animal's instinct, manifesting such
 desires as the desire for nourishment and the desire for reproduction.
 The physical body consists of various organs, muscles, and bones.  In
 order for man's physical self to grow in good health, it must take in
 air and sunlight, which are nutrients of a Positive nature, and also
 take in various foods and water which are nutrients of a Negative
 nature.  The physical self returns the Vitality Element to the spirit
 self.

 The spirit self was created to be the subject of the physical self; it
 can be perceived through our spiritual senses.  Even though a person may
 believe in the existence of the spirit self as a result of his life of
 faith, since fallen man has very poorly developed spiritual senses, he
 still has many questions about what happens to the spirit self after its
 separation from the physical self at death.  When separated from the
 physical self, does the spirit dissipate like smoke?  Is it just a
 spirit which leaves the physical self?  Does it go to the spirit world
 with a substantial form?  If it does go to the spirit world, does it
 merely merge into God, or does it occupy a separate place in the spirit
 world?  If so, what is the spirit like?

 Just as each person has his own physical self, he also has his own
 spirit entity; so the spirit entity is called a spirit self.  The spirit
 self is identical in appearance to the physical self, and it can
 communicate directly with God after it is perfect.  After leaving the
 physical body at death, the spirit self lives for eternity in the spirit
 world.  Man desires to live forever because he has a spirit self which
 has an eternal nature.  The spirit self consists of a spirit mind and a
 spirit body.  The spirit mind is the core of the spirit self,
 controlling the eternal life, love and ideals of man.  The spirit mind
 functions so that man lives a life of value, seeking for truth beauty,
 and love.  The spirit mind is the essence of the spirit self, is the
 subject of the spirit body, and is the place where God can dwell.  The
 spirit body is the body of the spirit self, just as the physical body is
 the body of the physical self.

 The spirit self needs nutrition for its growth and perfection.  The
 positive nutrient for the spirit self is the Life Element from God.  The
 Life Element from God is the basic element that develops Heart within a
 person and develops him as a being of truth.  On the other hand, the
 negative nutrient for the growth of the spirit self is the Vitality
 Element which comes from the physical self.  When the physical self acts
 in accordance with God's Word, it projects good Vitality Element for the
 growth of the spirit self.  The spirit self not only receives the
 Vitality Element from the physical self, but also projects in return a
 certain element which is called the Spirit Element. The Spirit Element
 is the element that gives joy and strength to the physical self.

 The relationship between the spirit self and the physical self is that
 of subject and object, with the spirit self growing and perfecting
 itself on the basis of its relationship with the physical self.  The
 quality of a person's physical life is converted into Vitality Element
 and transferred to the spirit self. Thus, the quality of the spirit is
 dependent upon the quality of the physical life.  Accordingly, a spirit
 self that receives wholesome Vitality Element from the physical self
 becomes a being of goodness, whereas a spirit self that receives bad
 Vitality Element from the physical self will become evil.  In order for
 an evil spirit self to become a good one, that person must repent while
 his spirit self is still in his physical self, for a person's evil
 spirit self is healed by receiving good Vitality Element through his
 repentance and faith in God's Word.

 The most important aspect of the spirit self which has to be perfected
 through the physical self is a person's sensitivity to the love of God.
 It was explained earlier that God's Purpose for the Creation is
 fulfilled through the family, the basic foundation in which his ideal of
 love can dwell.  Therefore, only a spirit person who while on earth has
 fully perfected his sensitivity to love as a child, as a husband or
 wife, and as a parent, all centered on God, can go to the Kingdom of
 Heaven in the spirit world. The Kingdom of Heaven is ruled and
 harmonized by the love of God; it is the place where all are satisfied
 through God's love.

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Date       04-19-92 10:17:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject            WITNESSING

 ND>      Terry, I am concerned about something.
 All created beings reach perfection through three growth stages. Based
 on the physical self. man's spirit also goes through three stages of
 growth.  A spirit self in the formation stage is called a form spirit;
 in the growth stage, a life spirit; and in the completion stage, a
 divine spirit.

 The relationship between the physical self and the spirit self is like
 that between a tree and its fruit.  A ripened fruit is harvested,
 whereas its vine returns to the earth.  Likewise, because the spirit
 self was created to live for eternity, after separating from the
 physical body it remains and lives eternally in the spirit world,
 whereas the body returns to the earth.  Many believe that man's physical
 body dies because he fell, but this is incorrect.  God warned in Genesis
 2:17 the "'...in the day that you eat of it you shall die.'"  Adam and
 Eve "died" as a result of eating the Fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge
 of Good and Evil.  Nevertheless, after Adam and Eve fell, they lived for
 several hundred years on earth and bore children.  This means that the
 death caused by the Fall is not the death by which the physical body
 returns to the earth.  As soon as the first ancestors fell by disobeying
 God's Word, their eternal spirit "died"--that is, their spirit selves,
 which could communicate with God, ceased to function.  Ecclesiastes 12:7
 says, "...the dust returns to the earth as it was, and the spirit
 returns to God who gave it." This indicates that the physical self's
 returning to the earth is in accordance with the natural order of the
 Creation.  A more detailed explanation of this matter will be given
 later, in the chapter "Resurrection."

 When a person lives in his physical body according to God's Ideal for
 the Creation, he will be living in the Kingdom of Heaven on earth, and
 the world where his perfected spirit self will go after his life on
 earth will be the Kingdom of Heaven in the spirit world.

 However, since God's Purpose for the Creation is to be realized on
 earth, his first objective in the work of salvation must also be man on
 earth.  Thus, God has over and over again sent his prophets to this
 faithless world and even sent the Messiah himself to earth.  This
 crucial role of the physical life (and self) is why the Bible teaches
 that "...whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and
 whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven" (emphases added)
 (Mt 18:18), and why it teaches us to pray that God's Ideal for the
 Creation should be realized on earth (Mt 6:10).

 It is not God who determines whether a spirit person goes to the Kingdom
 of Heaven or to hell.  It is each person himself who determines this
 through his daily life while in his physical body on earth.  Each person
 goes to the place in the spirit world corresponding to the stage of
 development that his spirit self attained while he was on earth.  God,
 the Messiah, and religion can only teach people how to avoid hell and
 show the way to the Kingdom of Heaven.  Whether or not one receives the
 teachings of God and church is the responsibility of each individual.

 In the world where the Purpose for the Creation is realized, Satan, sin,
 and hell cannot possibly exist.  In God's Ideal for the Creation, only
 heaven was to exist.  But because of sin, man lost his original value
 and became like refuse.  The place where this refuse is kept is what we
 call hell.

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Date       04-19-92 10:18:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject            WITNESSING

 ND>      Terry, I am concerned about something.
               The Human Mind in terms of the Relationship
                between the Spirit Mind and Physical Mind

 The relationship between the spirit mind and the physical mind is that
 of internal character and external form. When the spirit mind, which is
 subject, and physical mind, which is object, become one through Give and
 Take Action, a human mind is formed.  In a perfect person the spirit
 mind and the physical mind perform perfect Give and Take Action centered
 on God and unite, forming what is call the original mind.  Man's
 original mind always directs him toward the Will and Purpose of God.
 When the physical body returns to the earth, the physical mind ceases to
 exist, but the original mind, which is formed through the interaction of
 the spirit mind and the physical mind, remains within the spirit self.

 The spirit mind and the physical mind engage in Give and Take Action and
 unite centering on what man thinks is true.  We call this union the
 conscience of man.  A perfect human being always stands on the perfect
 truth.  Therefore, the original mind and conscience should not diverge
 in two directions, but should be united.  That is, the original mind and
 the conscience should relate as inner and outer aspects and always
 direct man toward God's Purpose and Will of goodness.  Fallen man still
 has within him the original mind, which directs him toward goodness.
 However, fallen people have lost the absolute standard of goodness, and
 therefore their standards of conscience differ from one another
 according to their opinion of what is true.  Wherever a different view
 or theology is held, a different direction of conscience will exist.

 Also, because man came under Satan's influence as a result of the Fall,
 his spirit mind cannot properly receive the Life Element from God and
 remains immature.  Such a spirit mind is incapable if being in the
 subject position to the physical mind and is instead dominated by the
 physical mind.  And when this immature spirit mind performs Give and
 Take Action with the physical mind which is under Satan's dominion,
 another mind is produce, one directed toward evil.  We call this mind
 the evil mind.  The original mind and conscience of man fight against
 this evil mind, which is against God's Will and direction, and direct
 man toward goodness.

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Date       04-19-92 10:20:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject            WITNESSING

 ND> However, the Catholic Chuch, as it degressed into apostacy, ND>
 started to use the term only for certain individuals, who have ND> done
 a certain amount of good ND> things and performed a certain number of
 miracles.

 I don't have a problem with that.  When Rev. Moon spoke with Lawrence
 Tribe, the foremost constitutional lawyer in America, he told Mr. Tribe
 that he should take it upon himself to write a constitution for the
 kingdom of God on earth... well I think he put it into different terms.
 <grin>

 When Rev. Moon spoke of this "world constitution" he said that it had to
 be different from all other constitutions in that the emphasis should
 shift from punishment for the wicked to rewards for the righteous
 actions of men and women. There has never been a constitution that was
 based on rewarding the goodness that people do. All constitutions to
 this point have gone into great detail to  spelled out punishment.

 It is only natural that Rev. Moon will initiate a new constitution for
 the world government emphasizing rewards because Biblical prophecy
 thousands of years ago already talked about Christ doing this:

 MAT 16:27   For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father
 with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his
 works.

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Date       04-19-92 10:29:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject            WITNESSING

 ND> You know as well as I do that the only way to find out ND> if
 something is true is to read ND> it, ponder on it, and ask God with all
 of your soul if it is ND> true.

 You and I know that... now if only traditional christians could come to
 grips with this most basic and elementary truth they could overcome so
 many obstacles that are causing their own decline AND unhappiness.

 ND> Do you have the pamphlet "The Prophet Joseph Smith's Testimony"

 No.

 ND> I would suggest that you invite a missionary over for discussion.

 What?  And get accused of "sheep stealing?"  haha  If I start discussing
 the Divine Principle, when those young guys start asking their local
 central figure ...what about?...  they will tell them "Do not go there
 any more."

 When I attended the Unification Theological Seminary, we had a Mormon
 instructor, who prepared the young men to go out on their mission, come
 visit several time and talk to us.  His advice and words of wisdom were
 most encouraging.  I will never forget his pointing out that the major
 stumbling block any leader must deal with is his followers.

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Date       04-19-92 10:39:00
From       Terry Blount
To         C. Spurgeon
Subject            WITNESSING

 CS> Moon has never done a miracle so why should we believe he is the
 CS> new Messiah what proof does he have other than himself.

 Give me a break!    If Rev. Moon walked on water, the media would print
 "Rev Moon  FAILS to swim."   Rev. Moon has matched and married over
 24,000 couples.  Can the president or anyone else on earth perform such
 a miracle?   Can you even match and marry one couple?  How about your
 minister?

 CS> Jesus proved who he was!

 Really, then why didn't the people believe in him.  No one would kill
 someone they thought was really the Messiah.   Moses proved God was
 working through him but the people soon forgot the miracles, and
 worshiped the Golden Calf... once again proving that miracles are no
 substitute for knowledge one has gained from prayer and meditation.

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Date       04-19-92 17:30:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Mike Barefield
Subject    HEAVEN

 MB> Terry, do you have any scripture for this level stuff or is this
 MB> just a Moon doctrine?  Where is heaven from your perspective?
 MB> Just curious.

 Do you have any scripture that maps the course to follow in a space ship
 to reach such a distant planet where God dwells? There is no such place.

 REV 21:3    And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the
 tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they
 shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their
 God.

 MB> There is no symbolism here.  Heaven is a place.  It is not dream
 MB> land or a cloud.

 Truly heaven is no dream place but I continue to challenge your theory
 that one can arrive at heaven by changing their physical location.
 Heaven is not a place like Oklahoma. If one could simply get to heaven
 by changing their location then we would not have a need for repentance,
 rebirth, prayer, fasting, Bibles, religion or anything else that brings
 a person closer to God.

 MB> Terry, Heaven is a planet.

 So what does the following qualifications have to do with going there:

 MAT 5:3     Blessed [are] the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom
             of heaven.
 MAT 5:10    Blessed [are] they which are persecuted for righteousness'
             sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

 You are attempting to rewrite scripture to say:  "Blessed is he who has
 a space ship for they could fly to heaven."  This is so amusing to me to
 think that heaven could a physical location that someone could go visit.
 If the same corrupted, selfish, fallen people on earth did get there we
 be called HELL.

 MB> I have thought about it.  Jesus will be there,  Moon, well,
 MB> sorry about that Terry, you see Moon isn't trusting in Jesus so
 MB> he won't make it unless he repents and turns to Jesus.

 I would venture you don't even know that Rev. Moon has made thousands of
 speeches, not even to mention the possibility you have read any of them.
 When you start second guessing someone with no information about what
 they really believe then that is no different from trying to solve a
 problem when all the variables are unknown.

 Why do you suppose the top scientist of the world have been meeting with
 Rev. Moon for the past 15 years?  Why has the most highly intelligent
 agency and the #1 enemy of Rev. Moon, the KGB, invited him to come to
 their country and teach their children the Divine Principle?  Why do
 intellectual people who actually find out what Rev. Moon is all about
 support him?  The only people I see persecuting Rev. Moon are those who
 know nothing or even worse that that, they believe the media.

 Truly scripture is ABSOLUTELY correct:

 Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said
 unto them, Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto
 you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. When once the master
 of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to
 stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto
 us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:
 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and
 thou hast taught in our streets. But he shall say, I tell you, I know
 you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. There
 shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and
 Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you
 [yourselves] thrust out. And they shall come from the east, and [from]
 the west, and from the north, and [from] the south, and shall sit down
 in the kingdom of God. And, behold, there are last which shall be first,
 and there are first which shall be last.
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 Please don't be last.  Pray to Jesus and ask him if he gave a mission to
 Rev. Moon.  Don't think you already know the answer.  That is guessing.
 There may be more than one way to get to heaven but guessing is NOT one
 of them.

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Date       04-20-92 07:59:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Mike Barefield
Subject    HEAVEN

 MB> WE actually agree Terry, I don't think you get there by simply
 MB> changing physical places.  However, I do believe that Heaven is
 MB> a physical place.  John in Revelation said he saw a new Heaven
 MB> and a new earth.  He saw them.  If he could see the earth and he
 MB> could see heaven then they are physical.

 Just go out into nature and take a good look the scenery then you may
 realize that God already created heaven and put man in it.  God did not
 go to the trouble of creating this most beautiful creation just to
 abandon it and leave it to Satan.  The establishment of the kingdom of
 God is a process of reclaiming/reestablishing the garden of Eden which
 was on earth.  The way to do that is to restore fallen man's internal
 character.  Even if Jesus could/did swoop down and take people away to
 another planet, the selfishness that was in the hearts of those people
 would follow and that place would be the same as the one they came from.
 HOWEVER, if the hearts of people were restored right here, this place
 would become the dwelling of God.  And that is the kingdom of heaven.

 Isa 34:16
 Seek ye out of the book of the LORD, and read: no one of these shall
 fail, none shall want her mate: for my mouth it hath commanded, and his
 spirit it hath gathered them. And he hath cast the lot for them, and his
 hand hath divided it unto them by line: they shall possess it for ever,
 from generation to generation shall they dwell therein. The wilderness
 and the solitary place shall be glad for them; and the desert shall
 rejoice, and blossom as the rose. It shall blossom abundantly, and
 rejoice even with joy and singing: the glory of Lebanon shall be given
 unto it, the excellency of Carmel and Sharon, they shall see the glory
 of the LORD, [and] the excellency of our God.


 MAT 18:18   Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth
 shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall
 be loosed in heaven.

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Date       04-20-92 08:21:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Bob Vonmoss @ 970/1
Subject     HEAVEN

 BV> When Jesus said, "Our Father who art in heaven," it's obviously
 BV> not referring to the earth, just as kingdom is not an earthly
 BV> kingdom like King Solomon's, which divided and crumbled, which
 BV> is temporal, but the eternal kingdom of God.

 HeavenS  and Heaven are not the same thing.  HeavenS connote the world
 we call outer space, where the sun, moon and other galaxies are located.
 Heaven is in the hearts of resurrected people.

 LUK 17:21   Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold,
 the kingdom of God is within you.
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 Do you agree that the kingdom of God and the kingdom of Heaven is the
 same place?  Can you live in the kingdom of God without living in the
 kingdom of Heaven?

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Date       04-20-92 08:28:00
From       Terry Blount
To         C. Spurgeon
Subject     HEAVEN

 TB>  vitality elements it receives from your physical body. When you
      lose your physical body you are stuck at that level and you enter
      the spiritual world at that level -- with NO quantum leap to
      another level, UP or DOWN.

 CS> I would like to see a little Bible support for this.

 Of all the qualification that the Bible speaks about in order to go to
 heaven, dieing is not one of them.  Christianity made a major error when
 they accepted the notion that one must die to attain salvation. Death is
 not a prerequisite for salvation even thought that is what traditional
 christianity teaches.

 MAT 16:19   And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven:
 and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and
 whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

 MAT 18:18   Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth
 shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall
 be loosed in heaven.

 LUK 17:21   Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold,
 the kingdom of God is within you.

 Why  don't you analyse this and tell me why you think Lazarus was
 tormented?   I'll give you a hint.

 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels
 into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in
 hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off,
 and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have
 mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in
 water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. But Abraham
 said, Son, remember that thou in thy LIFETIME receivedst thy good
 things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and
 thou art tormented.

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Date       04-20-92 08:46:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Bob Vonmoss @ 970/1
Subject         QUALIFICATION TO TO

 BV> And Jesus came to establish the 5 social relationships too,
 BV> right?

 Who can guess what a MURDERED man would have done.  Had he found faith
 he would have surprised everyone.  He may even have married and parented
 little messiah's.  We can only conclude that Satan was mighty anxious to
 get him killed. Satan definitely wasn't interested in letting Jesus die
 of old age.  What would frighten Satan the MOST?  Was it the possibility
 of more sinless children being born into his kingdom?

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Date       04-20-92 08:56:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Mark Bassett
Subject        QUALIFICATION TO TO B

 MB> BBS as Terry Blount and prevent it from changing your name to
 MB> Sysop so that your users will address messages to you and not
 MB> your pseudonym ?
 MB> Its your BBS which gives the name to your user. Anyway - I
 MB> sympathize.

 When users of a bbs leave a message to Sysop, when the mail is exported,
 the name Sysop is SUPPOSED to be converted to the name you have
 configured for the export utility.  When mail comes in under the name
 Terry Blount, it is converted to Sysop, AND when it is replied to like
 this one, it says Sysop on my bbs... then Sysop IS converted to Terry
 Blount on the way out....   NOW HERE IS THE PROBLEM... when a user
 leaves me a message with MEGAMAIL there is something different and Sysop
 in that instance does NOT get converted.  It may just have something to
 do with being case sensitive?   Anyway, if Mike logs onto my bbs and
 leaves a message to Sysop in THIS conference it will be converted to
 Terry Blount when the mail is exported...   ONLY when he leaves a
 message to Sysop with the Megamail off line reader, and that message is
 entered into he bbs, does it go out still with the name Sysop.   I can't
 figure out why?  It must be case sensitive, or  "[space]Sysop"  rather
 than "Sysop."   I am sorry this problem has not been resolved. I'll just
 have to watch my Megamail users and warn them to change messages to my
 name.

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Date       04-20-92 09:06:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Deborah Kinietz
Subject    Rightly Dividing

 DK> From what I understand you don't even believe in Jesus so why

 Where did you get that information?  It is incorrect.

 DK> talk about him? I believe that you serve Rev, Moon...well I

 Jesus anointed Rev. Moon with a mission.  Do you serve St. Paul when you
 follow his writings in the New Testament?  Neither Jesus, St. Paul nor
 Rev. Moon seeks/sought worship.  Did you forget what Jesus told Satan?
 LUK 4:8     And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me,
 Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him
 only shalt thou serve.

 DK> with another flaw, so I don't see any point of debating with you
 DK> or discussing with you all I can do is Pray that the Holy Spirit
 DK> will get your attention one day and make you see the truth.

 Sounds like you have given up?   I  often feel that way too, but prayer
 can do wonders to rejuvenate one's spirit.  If you don't want to
 understand this revelation Jesus gave in 1935 it is your loss.  You
 cannot serve Jesus however by ignoring his revelation to you.

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Date       04-20-92 09:13:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Jason Steck
Subject    Steve Winter

 JS> If anyone is interested, let me know and I will hurriedly finish
 JS> the documentation and release it publicly.

 I already have written and released such a utility named Insulate, about
 1 year ago.  If you want to save yourself the trouble you can call my
 bbs and get it.   Steve will change his name, add a hyphen or some other
 character to confuse a program that looks for his name.  Actually his
 name is Steve Winters not Winter.  When the spiritual world starts
 acting up you can always see Steve come on strong and crazy at the same
 time. Its a cyclical thing... like being married. <grin>

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Date       04-20-92 12:57:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Gerard Trigo
Subject    Questions

 I'm not really sure this message was meant for me because you were
 quoting DF  whoever that is?  But since God led you to ask me...  I
 can't let God down now can I ?  <grin>

 GT> Perhaps you would like to comment on the following thoughts:
 GT> Assuming that God exists and is a rational just God, does God
 GT> really care for man?

 Absolutely. Look at this beautiful creation that God created.  Did
 He just do all that for Himself?  What kind of satisfaction could He
 experience with rocks trees and animals?

 GT> Is man a special creation? If so Why?

 Absolutely.   Without an object, no subject can experience give and take
 and no happiness, satisfaction or joy can be be realized. In order for
 God to experience total fulfillment He HAD NO CHOICE but to create
 someone who could EQUALLY experience His life, love and ideals.  That is
 where and why He created humankind.

 GT> Whay *Real* evidence do we have for this idea? Why couldn't God
 GT> have created the Universe and the physical laws that operate in
 GT> it, and then just stepped back to watch what happened?

 I can't get no    s a t i s f a c t i o n   . . . .

 Do you get more satisfied by watching or participating?

 GT> In such a
 GT> scenario would God even Know that we exist? We could just be a
 GT> cosmic accident, or more likely a cosmic Joke.

 Humans can't even create a mosquito.  Something as complicated and
 organized as this creation and its inhabitants are no accident.

 However if we search for God only through rational thinking we won't
 come to know Him nearly as clearly as we would through talking to Him.
 Who do you think knew Shakspere best?   ...his wife or a modern
 scholar who read and studied ALL his writings?

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Date       04-20-92 19:58:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Christology           1/

 TB> The reason for this is that if Adam and Eve had perfected them-
 TB> selves and had become true human beings, true husband and wife,
 TB> and true parents, giving birth to descendants

 WC>     They were true human beings, true husband and wife joined
 WC> togeth- er by God Himself and they were true parents giving
 WC> birth to descend- ants.

 True Parents don't give birth to children who harbor sin nature and kill
 each other.

 WC>     They even had descendants who were the embodiment of
 WC> goodness. Enoch was so perfect that God took him to heaven
 WC> before he died.

 If Enoch was perfect he would have been the Messiah.  Jesus was the
 first person to grow to perfection.  Enoch was born with sin nature and
 did not even have the possibility to attain perfection... save through a
 sinless man.  But no sinless man came until many centuries later.

 TB> When a person fulfills the Purpose of the Creation, he becomes
 TB> God's body

 WC>     This is what the Divine Principle teaches but it is not
 WC> exactly what Scripture teaches. Certainly God's Holy Spirit
 WC> dwells within the believer but that physical body will NEVER
 WC> make it to heaven because it is a corruptible mortal body
 WC> (flesh).

 You must think the kingdom of God is a place like Mars?  Don't you know
 where Jesus said the kingdom of God was located?  Also you apparently
 think that God is really a weak and helpless God if it is not possible
 for Him to educate mankind and show us the course to restore our hearts
 while we are living in our physical, mortal bodies.  The body of man has
 never been in need of restoration... haven't you read; "the heart is
 deceitful above all things." ???

 WC> It is only by the miraculous word of God that the
 WC> believer's body (either dead or living) will be change in a
 WC> moment, in the twinkling of an eye into a glorified,
 WC> incorruptible, immortal body.

 Quit relying on miracles.  Miracles can't save anyone... it takes faith
 and action and God cannot have faith for someone else or act for someone
 else.  You must initiate your own personal return to God.

 WC>     This is what the Divine Principle teaches but that is a far
 WC> cry from what Scripture teach. There is no such thing as "The
 WC> Principles of Creation" in Scripture. The concept is
 WC> extra-biblical.

 "The time will come when I will tell you plainly of the Father."  Jesus

 WC>     Not on your life. There is nothing in fallen man that
 WC> resembles the Characteristics. It is only when one is born again
 WC> that one ac- quires these characteristics. The Bible calls them
 WC> the fruit of the Spirit. It is the acid test of a believer.

 Haven't you heard; "when he appears we shall be like him"  ?

 WC> TB> Man then functions as the medium through which these two
 WC> worlds TB> interact.

 WC>     Your knowledge of the spirit world is sadly lacking.

 That is a strange statement coming from someone who thinks the only
 spiritual activity that exist is evil and demonic.  You never though
 about what the saints may be doing, nor what scripture means when it
 says Jesus is coming with a "host from heaven."  Since Jesus appeared in
 1935  the "host from heaven" have been most active during these last
 days.  What do you think brought about the fall of the Berlin Wall and
 the collapse of Communism?  You are bring deep sadness to your ancestors
 though your reckless disregard for their efforts.  It is not easy for
 them to communicate with you and give you wisdom.   Do you think your
 ancestors who kept faith alive for you to witness the glory of the
 coming of the lord are sitting on their laurels and doing nothing?  Your
 failure to recognize the signs of the times is most heartbreaking for
 them.  All they want you to do is pray and open your heart to God's
 guidance.  Please try Walter.

 WC> The spirit world and the physical one react at many points not
 WC> related man.

 Everything is related to man.  Do you think the object of God's heart
 and love is a monkey or a rock?   Shallow thinking Walter... you can do
 better.

 WC>      A true human being is any human being. That is the way the
 WC> Bible speaks of man. It is interesting that it was necessary for
 WC> the bibli- cal definition to be changed by the Divine Principle.

 The concept of man being in God's image does not change no matter if it
 is worded differently when translated from Arabic and Hebrew to English
 or if it is translated from Korean to English.

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Date       04-20-92 20:32:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Christology           2/

 WC>     This is extra-biblical and is contradicted by Scripture.
 WC> There is only one individual that has ever been or ever will be
 WC> the incarnation of God. That was Jesus.

 You must have skipped over page  1.  Gen 1:27 says God's image is MALE
 and FEMALE, so Jesus at MOST could be only half God.  You need to go to
 a Jehovah's Witness camp and find out who Jesus was.  Fortunately I
 figured it out without having to go through such agony. <grin>

 WC>     However, the mediator was also required to be God while at
 WC> the same time man. It would not work any other way. I have
 WC> already sup- plied you with many Scripture demonstrating that
 WC> Jesus had both a divine and a human nature. You ignored all of
 WC> them and did not address a single one.

 Yes I did, I told you to repeat after me... there is only one God...
 there is only one God...  there is only one God.   Walter you got to get
 that polytheism out of your system before it is to late.

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Date       04-20-92 20:41:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Christology           4/

 WC>     Why is it better to keep people in darkness than allow them
 WC> to walk in the light of truth?

 It is not a question of keeping people in darkness, it is a question of
 maturity.  Had people been expecting the Messiah to be born of a woman
 it would have been so simple for Satan to confuse everyone, generation
 after generation until the 3 rd Adam was born.  You have to use common
 sense to understand this.

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Date       04-20-92 20:45:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject       GREETINGS

 ND> that Joseph Smith was revealed. If you find a passage in the
 ND> Mormon scripture
 ND> that seems as if it points to Moon, please look up the cross
 ND> reference (on the bottom of the page) and if that doesn'T clear
 ND> it up, please ask me.

 Fair enough, but we both can throw away our books and the Bible and talk
 to God and get direct results.  That is finally what I did when I had
 collected enough evidence to consider it worth the investment.  Remember
 that prayer is not the thing the we normally have on the top of our "to
 do" list.

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Date       04-20-92 20:48:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject     How can 3 be 1??!

 ND>  "Jesus Christ is JEHOVAH, so how could he be his own son?"

 I can't help but sense you are straying from the Mormon doctrine?  Not
 that the Mormon faith is familiar to me, but didn't Brother Smith see
 Jesus and God standing together at the kickoff?

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Date       04-20-92 20:50:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Jesus & Family

 WC>     You must take us for fools, Terry. You have not even...

 "Leade us not into temptation."

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Date       04-20-92 20:53:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Jesus & Family

 WC> the ball park. The expression means that Mary greeted Elizabeth
 WC> and nothing more.

 Ha ha he he.... if she greeted Elizabeth, why did Elizabeth not know
 till later...

 LUK 1:40    And entered into the house of Zacharias, and saluted
 Elisabeth.  And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the
 salutation of Mary..                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

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Date       04-20-92 20:56:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Jesus & Family

 WC> he would have instantly stepped outside the will of God and it
 WC> would have been sin. Jesus did not come to the earth to marry
 WC> and father children. You have NEVER produced a single verse of
 WC> Scripture which substantiates your position.

 It is the turth Walter,  won't you ask God?

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Date       04-20-92 20:58:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Qualifications

 WC> TB> How do you judge/discern/evaluate what I have experienced?
 WC> It TB> seems to me that to do such a thing would require some
 WC> kind of TB> special gift or talent that most humans don't
 WC> possess.

 WC>     In ourselves it is not possible to discern such a thing
 WC> beyond what the individual relates of that experience. However,
 WC> there IS a way. It is called the gift of the word of knowledge
 WC> and the gift of discernment of spirits. You can read about them
 WC> in I Corinthians 12.

 That's what I said.  We can't make any kind of instant evaluation about
 what a person has experienced unless we have some special gift that you
 brought to my attention from 1 Cor 12.

 WC> TB> Some people make their level of maturity clear and obvious
 WC> TB> through their childish remarks and contempt toward people
 WC> who TB> disagree with them, but after these goats are separated
 WC> from the TB> flock should we really try to grad the quality of
 WC> wool that is on TB> the remaining sheep?
 WC>
 WC>     That is beyond our capability, however it will be graded
 WC> when the believers stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

 See !   That is just what I was telling Bryan.

 WC>     You are right there. Here one can learn everything they did
 WC> not want to know about ---- (just fill in the blank).
                            love ?

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Date       04-20-92 21:03:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Rightly Dividing

 WC> TB> There will not be any such questioning.  If God doesn't know
 WC> what TB> I did then I'll just make up something. There is no
 WC> reason I TB> should be talking about what I did.
 WC>
 WC>     You will do no such thing. You will stand in judgment just
 WC> like everyone else. You will not even have the option of lying.

 That is EXACTLY my point.  By saying that I would lie should make you
 think about the concept of standing before God and answering questions.
 You only ask questions when you don't have the answers.  God has the
 answers so He doesn't need to ask me any questions.

 WC> TB> Looks like the old saved totally by grace theory is out the
 WC> TB> window.
 WC>
 WC>     It is for those who refuse to accept it. However, it is the
 WC> only method available for salvation.

 Are you saying that grace alone will save you?   Do you have so much
 grace that you don't need baptism, rebirth, repentance and purification?

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Date       04-20-92 21:08:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Sin                   1/

 WC> TB> Yes, but can you persuade people to remain celibate before
 WC> mar- TB> riage and monogamous afterwards?  Rev. Moon is the only
 WC> man in TB> history that has been able to do this and go on to
 WC> bless over TB> 24,000 couples in holy matrimony.
 WC>
 WC>     You blew it again. Not even the Rev. Moon has been able to
 WC> do more than persuade an insignificant percentage of the
 WC> population to do this. There have been groups which have been
 WC> celibate until marriage throughout history. One need only read
 WC> about them.

 How many couples have you matched and married?  How many children owe
 their sinless birth to the teaching and works of Walter Copes?

 WC> TB> Do you know why he can do this?  He discovered the fall of
 WC> man TB> was the misuse of sexual love.
 WC>
 WC>     The only problem with that is that it was not sexual love
 WC> that caused the fall. It was the desire to be like God. Sex had
 WC> nothing to do with it and was not involved in any way.

 Get real!  Even makers of pornographic movies know what Adam and Eve
 were doing...  how could you, a learned man, be so naive?

 WC> TB> Rev. Moon began his ministry because Jesus appeared to him
 WC> in a TB> revelation
 WC>
 WC>     It was not Jesus that appeared. God does not contradict His
 WC> own word. The doctrines of the Rev Moon are in direct opposition
 WC> to Scrip- ture. They are in no wise compatible. I have
 WC> repeatedly pointed out these contradictions with Scripture--none
 WC> of which you have ever addressed.

 What difference would it make?  You have never admitted any error and
 you continue to do the very same thing the religious people of Jesus
 time did to him.  They persecuted him for what they though to be a
 violation of the laws of Moses.  Surely you know that?  What you don't
 realize is that you have repeated history.  But you haven't discovered
 whose part you are really playing.  Believe me it is just as lethal for
 one's spiritual health to persecute and betray the second coming of
 Christ as it was for those who betrayed the first coming.

 WC>     So you are telling us not that Jesus told two lies and in
 WC> the same breath you tell us that He did not sin. You have Jesus
 WC> denying a thing twice and the third time admitting it. So which
 WC> of the three was a lie told by the sinless man who know no sin?

 Walter,  I can't get off first base with you so it is not possible to
 help you see much deeper things. I will try however.  Do you remember
 that Peter denied Jesus 3 times?  Everything must be indemnified.  Until
 you can understand that, you won't have a clue why Jesus denied Rev.
 Moon 3 times and at the third time, the spiritual world bowed down and
 Jesus then confirmed the fall of man was the misuse of sexual love.

 WC>     This is also extra-biblical. The Bible does not say this nor
 WC> does it imply this. It says that they disobeyed God. That is
 WC> rebellion. Nothing of a sexual nature about it.

 You simply gloss over the part about shame of nakedness, circumcision,
 celibacy, refraining from marriage, nothing that goes into the mouth can
 defies a man.... etc.    Just omit all that evidence and believe
 whatever you wish. You probably have enough grace to get to heaven
 without understanding why.

 WC>     God contradicts your doctrine.

 Just as he did the laws of Moses that Jesus violated....

 WC> You have yet to quote a
 WC> single verse of Scripture which tells us that God who created
 WC> the animals fully mature was incapable of creating a man and
 WC> woman as fully developed adults in every sense of the word.

 Mature adults would not make a decision to violate the only commandment
 God gave them.  Your theory is totally irrational.  No one can believe
 it anymore because the truth has been revealed.  Now you know why the
 sun will darken and the moon will not give its light when the light of
 the truth brought about by the resurrection of Jesus shines.  When a
 brighter light comes the light of the sun (New Testament) and the light
 of the moon (Old Testament) will appear to darken.

 WC> You are the one contradicting the word of God. The burden of
 WC> proof is upon you to prove yourself correct.

 I have not contradicted the word of God... just your mistranslation;
 that's all.

 WC>     Wrong again. He is not saying that they were fathered by
 WC> Satan. Neither is He saying that they are descends of children
 WC> fathered by Satan.

 Divine Principle agrees with you. You should have continued to read
 before you replied.

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Date       04-20-92 21:47:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Sin                   2/

 WC>     As far as God is concerned, we are already His sons, but
 WC> this has not yet been revealed to the world. The world does not
 WC> yet enjoy the blessings that will come when Christ establishes
 WC> His kingdom on earth and we reign with Him.

 You first have to find out who he is before you can do any reigning!
 Jesus had no one to reign with him after 33 years.  At least the 3 rd
 Adam has a few million people.  Why anyone who knows that Christ will
 return would FAIL to ask God if someone is the returning Christ after
 they have been told over 100 times... it totally unbelievable.

 WC> Apparently, when Christ establishes His
 WC> kingdom on earth, he will restore creation to a balanced,
 WC> symbiotic relation- ship, with nothing being hurt or destroyed
 WC> (Isaiah 11:6-10).

 So why not help him?  Even if Christ could do it all by himself, why
 would his followers want to let him work so hard?  Laziness?

 WC> At Christ's coming the nature of sin will
 WC> be destroyed and our mortal bodies will become immortal.

 More dreaming.  There is nothing wrong with out physical bodies.  They
 could be a little more finely tuned by healthier diets, exercise, and
 refraining from stimulants. The problem is that our mind is too weak to
 dominate our physical desires.  Even when we do develop the strength and
 will to subjugate our bodies, they will not last forever.  There is no
 such thing as an immortal physical body.  It the physical body was
 created to live forever then there is no reason for God to give man a
 spiritual body.  After all, God did not give man a spirit after the
 fall.  Just look at other creatures that have a physical body... animals
 don't die because they have sinned.  Plenty logical evidence that our
 mortal bodies will NEVER become immortal.  The only reason this
 irrational concept crept into man's thinking is because people have a
 sense that when they die they are not going to arrive at such a pleasant
 place... therefore they seek hope in a ridiculous belief that they
 will be given an immortal body and escape death. Well this is not going
 to happen no matter how much hope you may have.  If wishing could get us
 what we wanted we would all have had ponies when we were children.

 WC> TB> This is the result of Eve's committing the sin of
 WC> fornication TB> with the angel.

 WC>     Absolutely and totally extra-biblical. You have NEVER
 WC> produced a single verse of Scripture which says that Eve
 WC> committed a sexual sin.

 So Satan has bee successful in keeping his crime of statutory rape a
 secret... tell me what else is new.

 WC> Noteven your favorite passage about Adam and Eve and the "fig leaf"
 WC> being evidence that a sexual sin was committed. It only tell us
 WC> that they came into knowl- edge of sin. In essence they suddenly
 WC> had a conscience.

 So your thinking is that the ate something that suddenly gave them a
 conscience.  ...and you think I'm off base for suggesting that Adam and
 Eve gained knowledge through an illicit sexual relationship.  Do you
 know what is the Biblical meaning of the term "to know?"   Why kind of
 KNOWledge was attained from the tree of KNOWledge?  WAKE UP Walter !

 WC> TB> Therefore, the root of sin is not the first human ancestors'
 WC> TB> eating a literal fruit
 WC>
 WC>     Really? You have not presented any Scriptural proof of your
 WC> theory. You have only asserted that your are correct with no
 WC> text proof to back it up. (extra-biblical)

 MAT 15:11   Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that
 which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

 WC>     There was no blood relationship established. There was not
 WC> forni- cation committed by the serpent, Eve, or Adam. The sin
 WC> was rebellion against God. Neither have you presented any
 WC> scriptural proof that the tree was not a literal tree. You have
 WC> only your assertion that it is so.

 And circumcision, shame of nakedness, commandments against fornication
 and adultery.... etc,  etc, etc.    Still can't see the light can you?

 WC>     There is no such thing as "original sin" being passed on
 WC> from one individual to another. Each individual is held
 WC> accountable for their own sins and not those of another. I have
 WC> presented you the Scripture a number of times and as always you
 WC> continue to ignore. Perhaps when something is ignored it will go
 WC> away?

 Oh like Deuteronomy 5:9 ?

 DEU 5:9     Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them:
 for I the LORD thy God [am] a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the
 fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth [generation] of them
 that hate me,

 And how about blessings because of good merit of one's ancestors?

 2KI 10:30   And the LORD said unto Jehu, Because thou hast done well in
 executing [that which is] right in mine eyes, [and] hast done unto the
 house of Ahab according to all that [was] in mine heart, thy children of
 the fourth [generation] shall sit on the throne of Israel.

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Date       04-20-92 22:18:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Spirits

 WC>     Neither of these two verses address the issue of "thousands
 WC> of levels" in the spirit world. Why no enlighten us with an
 WC> interpreta- tion?

 No need, Jesus clearly says it for all to read:

 JOH 14:2    In my Father's house are many mansions: if [it were] not
 [so], I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

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Date       04-20-92 22:20:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject             WITNESSING

 ND> If you want the pamphlet THE PROPHET JOSEPH SMITH'S TESTIMONY
 ND> and do not want
 ND> to meet with missionaries to get it, I will send you a copy ,
 ND> via the post man.

 207 N.  Cumberland
 Metairie, La. 70003


 Got it on disk ?

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Date       04-20-92 22:23:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Witnessing

 WC> TB> I have no idea how this relates to Rev. Moon or Jesus?
 WC>
 WC>     It relates directly to THE Antichrist who will be running
 WC> things at that time. Without the mark no one will be allowed to
 WC> buy or sell anything. It will be the means by which he controls
 WC> the population. Anyone causing trouble will no be allowed to buy
 WC> or sell.

 Well if you had ever tried to sell flowers for Rev. Moon you would know
 that plenty people are allowed NOT to buy.  I suppose that lets Rev.
 Moon off the hook. <Grin>

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Date       04-21-92 07:51:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Steven Headley
Subject    ANTICHRIST

 SH>   Are you now saying that Paul wrote the epistles of John??

 No, but you sure danced around the question.  Why didn't the author of
 John  use your definition of antichrist?

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Date       04-21-92 07:53:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Steven Headley
Subject    GOD TOLD ME

 SH>     There you go again. Twisting and redefining words and
 SH> intent. Certainly the disciples were gazing up into heaven. You
 SH> deliberately failed to provide the reason in order to mislead.


 I suppose when one has something twisted and another person comes along
 and straightens it out the person who does not realize it is twisted
 think it is twisted when it is put in correct order. If you tied your
 shoes by lacing the stings from the top down and I came along and
 relaced your shoes in the correct order you would say I had twisted
 them.   Get the point?  Twisting and straightening is only relative to
 one's viewpoint. Jesus twisted a lot of Moses' teachings.  He broke the
 law of the Sabbath according to their twisted interpretation.  When
 Christ returns he will have to untwist a large majority of traditional
 christian doctrinal mistakes.   That is want I'm preparing you for.

 SH> TB> You are basing your salvation on doctrine that
 SH> TB> has been written and rewritten, interpreted and
 SH> reinterpreted for 2,000 TB> years by men.
 SH>
 SH>   Proof of this, please (other than the ramblings of Moon.)

 If you simply study the councils that canonized the New Testament and
 the Bible in its current form, that took place around 400 ad  you would
 have your proof.

 SH> TB> How can you even imagine that Satan didn't get the
 SH> TB> original message twisted during that time?
 SH>
 SH>   Because God said that the message would remain the same.  You
 SH> want to   believe Satan twisted it, that fine.  But God said it
 SH> isn't.  I'll   stick with God.

 Ok, I recant, the message is not twisted, it is the interpretation of
 the message that Satan was able to twist. Don't give me a hard time, I'm
 only trying to free you.   "Know the truth and it will set you free."


 TB> pray and ask God about what I have been telling you?  Prayer takes
     away the guesswork.

 SH>    I think tha Gary will hear from God the same answer that I
 SH> hear -

 Another one bites the dust...  you are the second person who told me
 prayer was of no importance since you already have all wisdom.

 MAR 14:38   Watch ye and pray, lest ye enter into temptation. The spirit
 truly [is] ready, but the flesh [is] weak.

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Date       04-21-92 08:12:00
From       Terry Blount
To         John Williams
Subject       God told me

 JW> It's realy too bad that this message base can't save more old
 JW> messages than dies, or you could look back, and see that I
 JW> profess everything as "my opinion."

 I have saved every message I have wrote or responded to in the past
 year.  If you ever need an old post that was from me, let me know.

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Date       04-21-92 11:01:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Dean Scott
Subject    HEAVEN

 DS> One your topic of where heaven is, I found that the Bible says
 DS> to me that Heaven is a literal place in the universe, maybe even

 Jesus sez' :

 LUK 17:21   Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold,
 the kingdom of God is within you.

 DS> after the lake of fire consumes every last trace of sin and

 I think the biblical meaning of fire is what we call truth. James says a
 tongue is a fire and the Old Testament often mentions the truth is the
 tongue.  And we have to wonder if this will literally happen:

 ISA 11:4    But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove
 with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with
 the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the
 wicked.

 REV 19:15   And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he
 should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and
 he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

 DS> you've traveled 1050 years into the future when the new earth is
 DS> guaranteed to be strongly in place and the center of the
 DS> universe where God's throne will forever be located, in other
 DS> words, earth will become heaven.

 It is already happening just as you speak. Have you ever noted where my
 messages originate?   Yes, the center of the cosmos!


 You are  an ok guy to talk to.  Unlike those stiff necked fundamental
 dudes that have never thought outside the box, you bring a fresh
 approach, laced with imagination.   Keep it up.

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Date       04-21-92 11:11:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Roger Hepworth
Subject    Moon Is A fake Christ

 RH> No bible support for him being christ.
 RH> no miracles.


 If miracles made a messiah, then Moses would be the super messiah of all
 times.  You have made a category blunder in seeking to see signs.  Jesus
 tried to prevent you from making such a mistake... why don't we read his
 words together once again?:

 MAR 8:12    And he sighed deeply in his spirit, and saith, Why doth this
             generation seek after a sign? verily I say unto you, There
             shall no sign be given unto this generation.
             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 RH> THE true Christ (that is Jesus) said meay will come saying I an
 RH> the christ but do not believe them.

 Many politicians make speeches proclaiming they have the answers to the
 woes of our society.  Most of them only offer some kind of quick patch
 like those that have resulted in our national debt of 4 trillion
 dollars.   However can we stop looking for solutions? Can we assume that
 since one politician claims to have a fix that won't work that there is
 not one who does know how to solve the problem?   You missed the point
 when you heard Jesus say that many would come saying they were the
 Christ.   Jesus' warning was meant to help us discern through evaluation
 with deep thought.  He never meant that Christ would not come again.
 That is unfortunately the way you want to interpret his words.

 Christ will come again and Jesus said that he may be rejected.  Why
 can't you give that prophecy equal weight?  How could anyone reject the
 Messiah?  The only way anyone could reject Christ is if they FAILED to
 recognize who he was.   That is what you have done my friend.  Rev. Moon
 IS the third Adam.  He was anointed by Jesus Christ to carry out the
 mission to establish the kingdom of God on earth.  The only reason you
 can't believe me is that you won't take it to God and seek verification.


 LUK 11:9    And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek,
 and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.

 I swear to you that I asked and God answered me.  I sought and I found.
 You seem to think that I somehow wondered upon someone who said Rev.
 Moon is the messiah now go out and sell peanuts and and give him all the
 money  and∙I thought that was such a good idea.  You have so much to
 learn.

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Date       04-21-92 11:34:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Steven Headley
Subject    QUALIFICATION TO BE BE H

 SH>        Are you trying to get to heaven simply on your physical
 SH> action -        or righteous works.  Are you trying to get to
 SH> heaven by        attempting to be "perfect??"

 YES !  I'm not going to suppose I can get to heaven through God's grace
 alone.  If God's grace was sufficient to save anyone we would have NO
 need for repentance, prayer, bibles, or religion.  What you don't
 understand is the concept of restoration through INDEMNITY.  You must
 purify yourself before you can dwell in heaven.  If you go as you are
 then you will take hell with you.   We don't need to worry about God's
 grace.  That is a given.  If God decided to limit or increase grace it
 would be nothing we could do about it at all.   What we must concern
 ourself with is OUR portion of responsibility and leave God's portion of
 responsibility to God.  I'll leave this with a quote from Jesus, maybe
 you will listen to him?

 MAT 5:48    Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in
 heaven is perfect.

 SH>   First off, your quoting was out of place.  Yes, I know the
 SH> solution.   And the solution is Jesus Christ.  Secondly, there
 SH> is but one Messiah   - that of Christ.  If you want to be
 SH> blinded and led astray by false   teachers, then have a nice
 SH> life.  As for me and my house, we will   serve the Lord.

 JOH 5:43    I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if
 another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

 You have received the teachings of the christian doctrines dreamed up by
 people like Peter Abelard, Martin Luther, and Augustine.  The road to
 hell is paved with good intent.

 TB> Mormons have and incredible deeper understanding of truth than whom
 ever TB> you are representing.  You would be better off to skip those
 messages TB> between myself and any Mormons for a while, till you get
 caught up in TB> your homework.

 SH>   Nice dodge.  I must go on the assumption that now you are also
 SH> saying   that Jesus is a liar.

 No, I can't get you past first base so the chances of you understanding
 deeper concepts like restoration through indemnity.  If you could get to
 second base, you may understand how the 3 times Peter denied Jesus had
 to be restored.  Then you can understand...   but you don't really want
 to know what I have to share.  Your remarks about Rev. Moon clearly
 prove you have no desire to understand.

 SH>   This is wonderful, Terry.  First you say that the scriptures
 SH> lie.   Then you say that Christ is a liar.  And you think that
 SH> you have the   truth??  Hardly.

 See you sad comments?  Could you hope to teach anyone with an attitude
 like this?

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Date       04-21-92 11:53:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Ronald Kinietz
Subject    Rev Moon?

 RK> Did not Jesus say that there would be MANY that come in my name
 RK> and say that they are HE? And that they were going to decieve
 RK> the very elect unless they watch and be ready. Could it be
 RK> possible that this Rev Moon that you are all gun ho for could be
 RK> one of those people that Jesus Himself spoke of?

 Yes, that is possible. Don't you think I have considered that?

 I can only assure you that prayer takes the guesswork our of such a
 dilemma.

 RK> Really if I were this Rev Moon guy I surly would come out and
 RK> say that I had Jesus blessing and try and decieve everyone that
 RK> I can.

 Let me ask you what you would do if Jesus came to you and gave you a
 mission and a blessing.  Would you try to hide it?  Would it appear to
 doubters that you were trying to decieve everyone?  When Jesus does
 appear to someone, they usually find themselves in a state of turmoil.
 Look at what happened to St. Paul and the early Christians who were
 martyred after having a meeting with Jesus.

 RK> All I can sujest that you be very careful and don't get caught
 RK> being decieved by the devil. It really is not worth it. I refuse
 RK> to go to hell for anyone.

 I have to say I feel a genuine concern coming from you, unlike that of
 other people who say the same thing but word it quite differently.∙I
 appreciate that.  I can only tell you that it is my testimony that after
 following the teachings of Rev. Moon for 16 years, I have seen the
 fruits that have convinced me that Rev. Moon is a man of God.  I did not
 choose to follow Rev. Moon because I wanted to sell followers and
 peanuts in the freezing K-Mart parking lots of Pennsylvania while being
 jeered and persecuted by the people I wanted to save.  I found Rev.
 Moon's teaching to be the truth, AND I found a man who understands the
 suffering of God and who loves the world with the heart of God.  Until
 you can feel the love of Rev. Moon, you will probably always doubt his
 message.   But you still have the option to pray and ask God about this
 man.

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Date       04-21-92 12:10:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Steven Headley
Subject    WHAT MUST WE DO?

 SH>   homework.  Well, here is a case where your "homework" fails to
 SH> stand   up to any sort of support.  Your grade for this one is
 SH> an "F."

 So now you are passing out grades?  Have you gone off the deep end?

 SH>     Nice to see that you feel that God is not omnipotent.  But
 SH> the fact     remains that the act of salvation is finished - we
 SH> can ignore that,     or partake of it.  That is still the choice
 SH> that we have.

 You really can't see the contradiction in your statement can you?  You
 say that God is omnipotent ...but we still have choice. You don't know
 who God is.  God is our parent.  Did your parents go to school on friday
 and take your test for you?  If you fail a test can you blame your
 parents?  If you go to hell can you blame God.  You fail to understand
 that omnipotence means omni-responsible.  If God is in total control
 then God is totally responsible for who is saved and who is damned.  So
 if you really believe in the omnipotence of God then you should believe
 that you have no choice.  Since you admit that you have the freedom of
 choice you contradict yourself.

 SH>    Man cannot reach out to a God that is already there, Terry.
 SH> You    keep saying that man needs to reach out to God, and to do
 SH> man's    part.  God has done all the reaching, Terry.

 I just can't believe you are so naive.  You do recognize that there is a
 gap between man and God.... don't you?  You think this gap can be closed
 by God alone?  If that were the case then God obviously doesn't want to
 be around us.  Think, think, think....   Try to realize that the gap
 between man and God is the result of man's failure, not God's failure to
 reach out to man.  Man can seek God. Man can reach out and make a
 relationship with God.... that is precisely the reason that religion
 came into existence.  Religion is an institution that teaches man how to
 repent, pray, and purify himself through obedience to God's word so that
 man can fulfill his portion of responsibility and come nearer to God.

 You are in some kind of strange religion that believes that we are
 helpless and that God is totally responsible for our salvation.  I tell
 you this is wrong.  If you pray and tune into the love of God you would
 find out that God is doing EVERYTHING in HIS power to close the gap.

 SH> God has done all the sacrifice.  If you want to ignore the wonderme
 SH> of this, that is    your choice.  All it means is that you are
 SH> ignoring God.  You want    to make your salvation like the Tower
 SH> of Babel and say "look at what    I have done for God!!"  It was
 SH> false back then, it is false now.

 You are sadly mistaken.  I never have dismissed the sacrifice and effort
 of God.  I only hope you can understand that you are wasting your time
 when you do ANYTHING that takes your focus away from your responsibility
 You are simply looking for an easy way to stay in your chair and leave
 your responsibility in God's hands.  God is not going to fulfill your
 responsibility for you.  You may as well forget that idea.

 SH>    But God teaches that works apart from faith is worthless,
 SH> Terry.    you want to rely on works.  As for me, I'll take
 SH> faith, and do God's    will.

 God's will in not for you to wait on God to do your responsibility.

 SH>    If you want to make the claim that these people know God
 SH> because of    you, then I think that you really need to think
 SH> again, Terry.

 So now you think that witnessing is a waste of time?  I don't know why
 you even bother to type messages to me.  Are you just seeking glory or
 do you believe you can save me?

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Date       04-21-92 16:17:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Agreement

 WC> Matthew 11:13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until
 WC> John.
 WC>     I find nothing here saying that there is no prophecy of the
 WC> Second Advent. Perhaps you should edify us on the subject. In
 WC> what way does this tell us that there is no prophecy of the
 WC> Second Advent?

 Read it once more and ask the question:  Will the second coming happen
 after John the Baptist came?  If the answer is yes then we know that
 Jesus taught us that the Old Testament prophecies concluded with John
 and there was NO prophecy of any second coming that would be a necessity
 if Jesus was rejected.  ...And would come after John.

 WC> TB> you are saying that God is responsible for the way we use
 WC> our TB> freedom.
 WC>
 WC>     You need to quote me here to demonstrate that you are
 WC> correct. I have said over and over that God will hold each
 WC> individual responsible for all their actions.

 So why was Jesus' crucifixion necessary?  If God was not responsible for
 the crucifixion of Christ then who was?  It was not God's will that
 Jesus be MURDERED.  Unfortunately there was no choice after Jesus was
 betrayed and rejected by the people who were responsible to protect him.

               still
 WC> TB>I really ^ can't figure out why you can't understand that.

 WC>     Mary gave birth to God incarnated in human flesh. Jesus had
 WC> a dual nature. He was both God and man.

 So why can't God do it again?  Why do you think that God won't do it
 again?

 WC> I KNOW that Christ will
 WC> restore all things. I also know that He will do so exactly as
 WC> the Scripture says and not as the Divine Principle says.

 Then there is no way out of accepting the belief that God will have
 grandchildren since the children of Adam and Eve were of their father
 the devil.

 WC> TB> Scripture please.
 WC>
 WC>     Wrong again. You are the one in need of interpreting for us
 WC> not the other way around. You have not established that the
 WC> quoted verse had anything to do with the subject at hand.

 Why do you always ask me for scripture then bow out when I ask you?  You
 don't play fair.

 TB> with God: for with God all things are possible.

 WC> I don't seem to be the one having a problem with this
 WC> passage, Terry. You on the other had do not believe it possible
 WC> for God to cause a woman to conceive supernaturally. You believe
 WC> it can only happen through natural means.

 I never said it was impossible, I clearly stated that such a thing was
 highly irrational and unnecessary.  You are the one who has repeated on
 several occasions that God can never have grand children and that God
 can never restore man while we are living in the flesh.  Do I need to
 dig up those messages to remind you where you claim God is limited?

 TB> You love prophecy of gloom and doom.

 WC>     The truth is that I love them all. I do not pick and choose
 WC> which ones to believe and which ones to ignore and proclaim as
 WC> false. Since you like to quote Revelation then we need to look
 WC> at some of the other passages in the book.

 Ha !   You throw out every scripture that teaches God and Jesus are two
 different individual beings and opt for a variation of the trinity
 concept.  You pick and choose all over the Bible.  You ignore scripture
 that says children suffer because of their parents sin.  etc etc etc.

 WC>     No matter how distasteful these prophecies are for you,
 WC> Terry, they are still in the Book and will be fulfilled exactly
 WC> as all the other have/will be.

 Let's talk for a moment about what is distasteful to you... for example
 after Adam and Eve sinned they hid their sexual parts because that is
 where their shame resided that they wanted to cover.... let's talk about
 the words of St. Paul and St. Stephen who said that it was a mistake to
 murder Jesus Christ.  Let's talk about the prophecy of the second coming
 of Christ being born from a woman.  Let's talk about the marriage of the
 Lamb...   you are really the one most guilty of picking and omitting to
 suite a lame dogma.
 WC> TB> Procreating children born with sin nature will someday be
 WC> one of TB> those former things that are passed away.
 WC>     If it be so it will not be because Jesus came to the earth
 WC> and married and fathered children.
 Correct.  His brother the 3 rd Adam, Rev. Sun Myung Moon has been the
 one who already did it... 13 times in fact!   You still don't know the
 sign of your times.  Pray Walter, pray.
 WC> He that stated there would be no marriage in the resurrection.
 The resurrection has come and gone.  We are now living in the post
 resurrection period.  You still don't know the sign of your times.
 Pray Walter, pray.

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Date       04-21-92 16:44:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Children              1/

 WC>     That is true. However, I have discovered the Scripture and I
 WC> do have understanding. I also have a one on one relationship
 WC> with the God of heaven. We do talk to each other.

 Why do you suppose God gives you an opposite direction from the
 direction He gives me?  Let me guess.... one of us is not corresponding
 with God?

 WC> WC> The Scripture does not teach that man (the masses) will ever
 WC> WC> cooperate with God either through the desire to do so or
 WC> WC> accidentally or even through force.
 WC>
 WC> TB> REV 21:3  And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying,
 WC> Behold, TB> the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will
 WC> dwell with them, TB> and they shall be his people, and God
 WC> himself shall be with them, TB> [and be] their God.

 WC>     Your reference is referring to conditions after the final

 When you don't like scripture you just explain it away.... then you say
 I am the one picking and choosing...  well I'm keeping your messages and
 our children will be the judge.

 WC> TB> Just one taste of the love of God through the True Parents
 WC> and TB> you will see.
 WC>
 WC>     Sorry, but the Scripture tell a different story. Scripture
 WC> is the word of God. God does not change.

 Right, but man changes frequently.

 TB> How could the people have been born of fornication if their
 TB> parents were actually married by God?

 WC> Scripture clearly tells us that a person belongs to the
 WC> one they obey. You seem to have this hangup about sex. As a
 WC> result you have had to redefine the words and meanings so that
 WC> the passage has another mean- ing. Jesus was not addressing
 WC> sexual misconduct here.

 Read it again:

 JOH 8:41    Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be
 not born of fornication; we have one Father, [even] God.
 JOH 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me

 Fornication is sexual misconduct.  Purity is not a sexual hangup.  The
 term "sexual hangup" was created by Satan to give people the confidence
 that fornication and adultery was "cool" because it liberated them from
 "sexual hangups."  Are you "liberated" Walter?  You seem to have the
 same claim as the people arguing with Jesus.... we be not born of
 fornication....     YES YOU WERE !

 WC> He was telling the crowd that they were
 WC> sinners and that as a result they obeyed Satan and as a result
 WC> he was their father. Satan did not sire a single one of them.
 WC> They all had natural human fathers. So your accusation that they
 WC> were illegitimate is incorrect.

 Some day you will understand why Jesus said that fallen people were born
 of their father the devil.  You can try to hid it like Adam but it won't
 go away.  Until we face our sin and repent for our misuse of sexual love
 and are blessed in marriage by God, our children will continue to be
 vipers.  Satan fornicated with Eve.  And he is still trying to use you
 to hide his terrible  crime.

 WC>     First, it is undeniably true that children's lives are
 WC> affected by the decisions and actions of parents and other
 WC> ancestors. The two influences on a person are heredity
 WC> (determined completely by ances- try) and environment
 WC> (determined largely by parents in the crucial first years). Nee
 WC> explained this family solidarity:

 So,  to a limited extent you do recognize that children are born with a
 merit or lack of merit depending upon the parents, family and lineage
 they are born into.  We may not be so far apart on this after all.

 DEU 5:9     Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them:
 for I the LORD thy God [am] a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the
 fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth [generation] of them
 that hate me,

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Date       04-21-92 17:04:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Children              2/

 WC> The problem here is that God would
 WC> condemn us apart from our personal acts, which seems to violate
 WC> basic princi- ples of justice revealed by conscience and
 WC> Scripture.

 So why would anyone ask Jesus this question:

 JOH 9:2     And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin,
 this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?

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Date       04-21-92 17:06:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Children              2/

 WC> WC>     Salvation remains an individual thing. It has been that
 WC> way WC> from the beginning. No one will have eternal life based
 WC> on the WC> merits of what his parents did or believed.
 WC>
 WC> TB> So Mary had no merit?  God just picked her at random?
 WC>
 WC>     Regardless of Mary's moral uprightness she still needed
 WC> salvation just as did all the 120 in the upper room on the Day

 You sure ducked the question.  Why did God pick Marry to be the mother
 of Jesus?  Go ahead and tell me it was totally at random.  That is the
 ONLY way you can support your doctrine that each individual is totally
 independent of their ancestral heritage and their path to salvation.

 WC Your reply is little more than a smoke screen to
 WC> draw attention away from the issue and sidetrack the discussion
 WC> on another subject. Mary was not the subject nor the issue being
 WC> discussed.

 Well she is now... so why not tell us why God chose Mary?  Clearly there
 must be some reason.   When you find your doctrine getting weaker you
 scream "smoke screen."  Why not deal with the question?  Why not admit
 that God would be an unjust God if He did NOT send His son to a family
 and a nation that had a rich history of faith and obedience?  I'll tell
 you why, because it wipes out your concept of individual salvation.
 Individual salvation does not exist.  When we get drunk on the blood of
 the saints it means we have betrayed the ones who sacrificed to bring us
 the blessings and opportunities we now enjoy.  America is falling
 rapidly because we are not investing in the future.  Clearly the 4
 trillion dollar debt we have now have racked up is evidence of the
 outcome of such a doctrine of individual salvation which preaches: "I'm
 saved too bad for you."

 Clearly the people who don't like Rev. Moon are the ones who love the
 individual salvation heresy.

 WC>     No, Terry, the Scripture does not say that I cannot discern
 WC> the signs of the times. YOU say I cannot discern the signs of
 WC> the times. However, I have repeatedly demonstrated from
 WC> Scripture that you are incorrect just as your are incorrect here
 WC> in your personal assessment.

 MAR 8:12    And he sighed deeply in his spirit, and saith, Why doth this
 generation seek after a sign? verily I say unto you, There shall no sign
 be given unto this generation.

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Date       04-21-92 17:25:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Holiness              1/

 WC>     You are not telling the truth here, Terry and you know it.
 WC> Jesus and John the Baptist were second cousins not blood
 WC> brothers or even half brothers. The relation existed because
 WC> Elizabeth and Mary were first cousins.

 Hardly the facts.  Jesus' and John's relationship was the results of
 Mary saluting Elizabeth.

 WC>     I don't mean to be ugly about it, Terry but this is

 Are you really trying to reform?

 WC> TB> What do you think it means to "salute Elizabeth,"
 WC>
 WC>     "Salute Elizabeth" means to "Greet Elizabeth." It is
 WC> necessary to redefine words in both the Greek and English
 WC> languages to have it mean anything else that "greet."

 Nice try, but we clearly know that Elizabeth did not know about this
 salutation till later:

 LUK 1:40    And entered into the house of Zacharias, and saluted
 Elisabeth. And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the
 salutation of Mary.                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 WC> 5959. 'almah, al-maw'; fem. of H5958; a lass (as veiled or
 WC> private):--damsel, maid, virgin.

 Only one of those possible terms even connote any inexperience of sexual
 knowledge.  Looks like I'm right.

 WC>     The answer is very simple. It was God and not Zacharias.
 WC> Whoever fed you the lie that Zacharias was the high priest

 Let's get this straight...  you agree that Zacharias was high enough to
 be the father of the "greatest born of woman," but yet unfit to be
 called a high priest... ha ha ha  you got me laughing.  If anyone had
 been a higher priest in God's eyes, then it would have been unjust for
 God to grant a measly "little" priest, like you claim Zach was, the
 privilege of fathering the man to fulfill the mission of the second
 coming of Elijah.

 WC>     Why is it necessary to materialize in human form to do so?
 WC> If God is incapable of miraculously bring about the pregnancy of
 WC> a virgin then neither is He capable of creating the universe,
 WC> the stars, pla- nets, plants, fish, birds, animals, and humans.
 WC> In short He is not God.

 First you jump in on a very deep and complex issue where I was talking
 about the Mormon theory of the conception of Jesus.  Jumping in is fine,
 but you must realize that I know you believe in some kind of hocus pocks
 and not the physical union of God and Mary.  Now that we have that out
 of the way... please tell us how God materialized his sperm to fertilize
 the egg in Mary's womb... or did God drop the whole package to be
 incubated for 9 months?   God is not in the business of impregnating
 women.  Where ever did such a concept come from?  ...maybe Satan is
 accusing God of doing the same thing with Mary that he tried to do with
 Eve?   How did anyone ever fall for such an idea... even when it was not
 even mentioned in the New Testament by people who knew all about Jesus
 and his birth?  If I were born of a virgin and EVERYONE who wrote
 ANYTHING about me that would start on page 1 by talking about my
 conception.

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Date       04-21-92 17:49:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Holiness              2/

 WC>     Your description to inadequate. You do God an injustice by
 WC> forc- ing Him to be "parents." In Scripture God is referred to
 WC> as masculine. You may not like it but "thems the facts."

 Oooops,   looks like you skipped over page 1 of your manual:

 GEN 1:27    So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God
 created he him; male and female created he them.
                          ^^^^^^

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Date       04-21-92 17:51:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Messiah

 WC>     On the other hand it points out a grievous fault in the Rev.
 WC> Moon. It is one which should greatly concern you. You speak much
 WC> of love. Jesus had the power and authority to heal. The
 WC> Scripture says that He was moved with compassion and healed
 WC> their diseases and af- flictions. That comes under the heading
 WC> of Love. If the Rev. Moon truly have love for people in his
 WC> heart as Jesus did and if he is the Messiah then he would be
 WC> moved with compassion and heal the sick and afflictions. We have
 WC> only the fruit he produces to go by. The Rev Moon does NOT heal
 WC> the sick and afflicted. Why not? You say he is the Messiah.

 He IS, and He does.  He teaches us that sexual promiscuity is the root
 and cause of the fall of man and all subsequent misery, including
 disease and despair.  The very commandment that God gave to Adam and
 Eve... do not partake of sexual love... is the #1 problem that Jesus
 gave Rev. Moon to solve.  Why don't you support Jesus? Jesus came during
 your own lifetime and gave a message to fallen man through Rev. Moon and
 you can understand it if you try.  (Well I could be mistaken about when
 you were born...  was it before 1935?)

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Date       04-21-92 17:56:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Douglas Burns
Subject     Nature of God

 DB>                          P.PRESTON

 Why is P.Preston singing Douglas Burns messages? Looks like we have a
 kook in our presence?  ....and I don't mean Steve Winter... although
 that matter is still under debate.

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Date       04-21-92 17:59:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Prophecy

 WC>     God is not a biological creature. He is Spirit. A Spirit
 WC> hath not flesh and bone. All warm bloodied animals (and others
 WC> also) are either male or female. That does not mean that God is
 WC> a cow or a dog or whatever. God is Spirit.

 Go back to page 1 and start over....

 GEN 1:27    So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God
 created he him; male and female created he them.

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Date       04-21-92 17:59:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Qualification

 WC>     If the things described in the Divine Principle are what the
 WC> Rev. Moon was told then it was another Jesus doing the talking.
 WC> God does not contradict Himself.

 Hey, that is exactly what Jesus said when people made the same kind of
 accusation about him as you have made about Rev. Moon.  Ever time a
 person comes along who is working for God, the majority of people say he
 is working with the devil.  Once again you have proved Rev. Moon is on
 God's side.

 WC>     Sorry to pop your balloon but when Rev. Moon dies he will
 WC> remain in his grave until Judgment day. The tomb of Jesus was
 WC> empty on the third day--Jesus arose from the dead. The entire
 WC> emphasis on the burial was the empty tomb and the resurrection
 WC> of Jesus on the third day exactly as prophesied.

 You conveniently forget that BOTH Moses and Elijah had already been seen
 with Jesus before Jesus was resurrected... or even crucified.  If
 resurrection made one a Messiah, then Moses and Elijah also qualify.

 WC>     The sad thing is that the Rev. Moon can save no one either.
 WC> His blood will not redeem anyone--not even himself.

 ...Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.

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Date       04-21-92 18:07:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Spirit

 WC>     And this is exactly what happens. It will continue to happen
 WC> until the resurrection. Jesus is the first to be resurrected.
 WC> The Bible is exactly correct. When the body is put in the grave
 WC> it decays. When the resurrection occurs it will come out of the
 WC> grave exactly as did Jesus come forth from the grave.

 How long have you had this science fiction passion?   Do you think a
 resurrected person with a glorified physical body can recover like a
 cartoon character if they got run over by a truck?  I'm sorry, I just
 can't accept such fictional doctrine.

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Date       04-22-92 11:15:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Gerard Trigo
Subject    Evidence

 GT> We have no evidence outside of the Bible itself that Christ
 GT> even existed. We accept that he existed, because of the oral
 GT> tradition as well as the bible support this claim.

 And we live in the year 1992  A.D .... <grin>

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Date       04-22-92 15:22:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Gerard Trigo
Subject    Why

 GT> You can only guess what God might be like as a rational,
 GT> logical being. Rationality and logic do not imply that he has
 GT> the same emotional needs as we do.

 The fundamental questions about life and the universe cannot be finally
 resolved without understanding the nature of God, the Creator. This is
 so because in order to understand and solve the problems concerning any
 resultant being we must first understand the causal being.  So in order
 to answer the most basic questions about all resultant beings, we must
 first understand the nature of God, the Creator, and the principles by
 which he created the world.  "The Principles of the Creation" explains
 God's nature and these principles, and thus answers the fundamental
 questions about life and the universe.

                     The Dual Characteristics of God

 How can we know the nature of God, who is invisible?  We can know it
 through observing the Creation.  Just as the work of an artist is a
 visible manifestation of its maker's invisible nature, every being in
 the Creation is a substantial manifestation of the invisible nature of
 God, ivs Creator.  Just as we can sense an author's character through
 his work, so can we perceive God's nature through his Creation.

 For this reason, Paul said,

    Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely,
    his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things
    that have been made.  So they are without excuse.... (Rom 1:20)

 We will determine what God's nature is like by finding the
 characteristics which are common to all entities in his Creation.


      The Dual Characteristics Internal Character and External Form

      We find that all existing being have both an invisible, internal
 character and a visible, external form.  Internal Character is the inner
 nature or character of any being, whereas External Form is the aspects
 of matter, structure, and shape of any being. For instance, in man,
 simply speaking, Internal Character is the invisible mind and External
 Form is the visible body.  In animals, the invisible instinctual mind is
 the Internal Character, while the tissues and organs forming an animal's
 body are the External Form.  In plants, life and the various invisible
 internal characteristics are its Internal Character whereas the material
 part made up of the cells is its External Form.  The same principle can
 be applied to the Elements.  The physicochemical character of molecules,
 atoms, and particles is their Internal Character, while the visible
 matter and structu re are their External Form.  In man, the mind is the
 subject and motivator of the body; thus the body moves according to the
 direction of the mind.  Likewise, the Internal Characters of animals,
 plants, molecules, atoms, and particles direct and control their
 External Forms.

      The body, which is External Form, reflects and resembles the mind,
 which is Internal Character.  Though the mind cannot be seen, it has its
 own "form", and the body, which reflects and resembles the mind, assumes
 a corresponding form. Mind and body are simply the inner and outer
 aspects of the same person, with the mind being causal and in the
 subject position to the body.  This is the reason one can perceive
 things about a man's mind and destiny by examining his outer appearance.
 From this, we can understand that Internal Character and External Form
 are simply the inner and outer aspects of each being.  Internal
 Character is the causal aspect and stands in the subject position to
 External Form; External Form is the resultant aspect and stands in the
 object position to Internal Character.  Accordingly, External Form may
 also be called the second Internal Character.  Together we call them
 dual characteristics.

 Since God is the First Cause of all beings and each created being has
 dual characteristics of Internal Character and External Form, God must
 have Internal Character and External Form (Rom 1:20).  God's Internal
 Character and External Form are in the subject position to the Internal
 Characters and External Forms of the created beings.  God's Internal
 Character, which is in the subject position to the Internal Characters
 of all created beings, is called the Original Internal Character, and
 his External Form, which is subject to the External Forms of all created
 beings, is called the Original External Form.  It should be emphasized
 that God's Original Internal Character and Original External Form do not
 exist as independent entities, but in harmonious reciprocal relationship
 with one another. God is the subject being of harmonized Original
 Internal Character and Original External Form, and his is the First
 Cause of the resultant world.

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Date       04-22-92 15:27:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Gerard Trigo
Subject    Why

 GT> You can only guess what God might be like as a rational, GT> logical
 being.

            The Dual Characteristics Positivity and Negativity

 We also find that throughout the Creation there is a reciprocal
 relationship between  Positivity and Negativity. ( They in no way
 connote good and evil, good  and bad, or constructive and destructive.)
 For example, atoms themselves have positive or negative characteristics,
 Based on such characteristics, two or more atoms enter into a reciprocal
 relationship between positive and negative elements.  Atoms themselves
 have positive or negative characteristics. Based on such characteristics
 two or more atoms enter into a reciprocal relationship, forming
 molecules.  Plants have male and female elements.  Similarly, most
 animals reproduce through relationships between male and female. All
 plants and animals exist and reproduce by virtue of myriad internal and
 external interdependent relationships of positive and negative elements.
 The Bible says that God was not satisfied with man alone (Gen 2:18)--So
 he made a woman, Eve, as Adam's object.  Then for the first time God saw
 that his Creation was ". . . very good."  Mankind is composed of men and
 women, and human society exists and develops through the reciprocal
 relationships between men and women.

 The relationship between Positivity and Negativity is similar to that
 which exists between internal character and external form.  Positivity
 and Negativity have the reciprocal relationship of subject and object,
 cause and result, internal and external; so Positivity and Negativity
 together are also called dual characteristics.  The Creation is made in
 such a way that everything exists through the reciprocal relationship of
 Positivity and Negativity.

 Then what is the source of these dual characteristics of Positivity and
 Negativity, which can be found throughout the Creation?  Since all
 beings are resultant beings, the elements they have in common must have
 originated in their ultimate source--God, the Creator.  The fact that
 the Creation is composed of dual characteristics of Positivity and
 Negativity means that God himself, who is the First Cause of all things,
 is the origin of the dual characteristics of Positivity and Negativity.
 This fact can be understood from Genesis 1:27:, which says, "So God
 created man in his own image . . . male and female he created them."

 God is the being whose Positivity and Negativity attributes stand in the
 subject position to all the Positive and Negative aspects of created
 beings.  We call God's subject Positive and Negative aspects Original
 Positivity and Original Negativity.  God's Original Positivity and
 Original Negativity are harmonized within him; so God is the First Cause
 of the resultant world and exists as the being of harmonized Positive
 and Negative aspects.

                     The Dual Characteristics of God

      Let us look at these dual aspects in man.  First, in the mind, or
 Internal Character, there is positive emotion, which is bright or
 lively, and there is negative emotion, which is sentimental or placid.
 There is positive intellect, which is active, and negative intellect,
 which is passive. There is positive will, which initiates and takes
 charge, and there is negative will, which is passive or responsive.
 There are also positive and negative aspects to man's physical body, or
 Extrnal Form.  The protruding, or convex, parts are the positive
 aspects, whereas the sunken. or concave, parts are the negative aspects.
 Thus we can see that Positivity and Negativity are attributes of
 Internal Character and External Form.

 Original Internal Character is the mind of God, which includes emotion,
 intellect, and will, as well as concepts and law.  However, the most
 essential of God's internal characteristics is Heart.

 The Original External Form is God's external attributes and is the
 origin of the substance and form of all created beings: man's body, the
 bodies of the animals and plants, and the substance and form of
 inorganic matter.

              The Relationship between God and the Creation

 Every created being is God's substantial object, that is, each being is
 the visible and substantial expression and form of the dual character-
 istics of God, who exists as the invisible subject.  When a created
 being becomes a perfect object to God, the subject, the Will of God is
 fully realized.  In other words, the completed world is like one perfect
 organic body which moves or remains calm only according to God's Purpose
 for the Creation.

 Though all created being reflect God's dual characteristics, they can be
 classified into two categories: (1) Man, and (2) all other things. Man
 is created to be the image of God, and thus he is called the substantial
 object in the image (image substantial object) of God. All other things
 resemble God symbolically, and thus are called symbolic substantial
 objects of God.

 When we look at God and the Creation as a whole, the relationship
 between God and the Creation corresponds to that between Internal
 Characterand External Form.  God is the invisible, internal cause and
 the masculine subject to Creation; the Creation is the visible, external
 result and the External Form, feminine object of God.

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Date       04-22-92 19:16:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Deborah Kinietz
Subject    GOD TOLD ME

 DK> I'm going to but in here, you are right to an extent yes the
 DK> fall of man was sin not just sexual sin but all sin.

 Adam and Eve committed one act of disobedience ( well Eve did it twice,
 once with Lucifer then again with Adam ...but)  what was this act of sin
 they committed.  There could not have committed all sin because there
 was no way that they could have stolen from someone or killed anyone.

 DK> I agree with having God's view about doctrines, and the bible is
 DK> God's word. I'd like to hear more about this talk Rev. Moon had
 DK> with Jesus, if you don't mind.

 Sure, anything you want to know.  I wasn't there, but the meeting and
 subsequent revelations resulted in the works known today as the Divine
 Principle.

 DK> It was God's plan for Jesus to die on the cross,

 No, Jesus' death became the price that had to be paid for the
 faithlessness of the people God had chosen to receive him.  Until Jesus
 was rejected, there was no need for Jesus to have gone the way of the
 cross.  I know that traditional Christianity views Jesus' mission as
 inevitable ending on the cross, but that is not what Jesus told Rev.
 Moon.  Jesus came to restore the failure of Adam.  He was called the
 last Adam.  Essentially Adam brought sinful children into the world.
 Jesus mission was to celebrate the marriage of the Lamb and parent
 sinless children.  Satan invaded through the people, just as he invaded
 God's first plan through tempting Eve.  Satan was anxious to take Jesus
 physical life.  He tried once through the 3 temptations and then as
 scripture points our "waited for an opportune time."   Then at the
 opportune time, he invaded Judas and played a crucial role in sending
 Jesus to the cross.  Satan only wanted one thing and that was to kill
 Jesus before Jesus could procreate sinless children.  Sinless children
 grow up to be messiah's and Satan had already suffered a severe setback
 with one sinless child.  He surely didn't want to see more.

 DK> He died for our
 DK> sins so that we might be saved, and able to communion with the
 DK> Father. The only thing that I could have done and did do to put
 DK> Christ on the cross was sin. God loved us and wanted us to be in
 DK> communion with him again that's why Jesus died on the cross he
 DK> knew it was going to happen beofre any one eles did, he knew
 DK> what his purpose was on earth. I'd still like to find out more
 DK> about this mission, not being sarcastic I just want to
 DK> understand where you are comming from.

 Jesus said he had the power on earth to forgive sins.  With that power,
 he could have forgiven and restored a bride and then established the
 first God centered family. Once the True Parent's family is established,
 then fallen man cam be adopted into that family an through faith,
 obedience and attendance, receive the blessing of marriage from God
 through Christ.  That is the plan for the restoration of the world.
 This process has already began.

 DK> Sorry about the intreuption but my curiousity got the best of me.

 Maybe you are lead by the Holy Spirit to learn something?

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Date       04-22-92 19:33:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject        GREETINGS

 ND>     Terry, you are right about talking to God for advice. But
 ND> when we do talk
 ND> to our Heavenly Father we must make sure that our mind is clear
 ND> and ready for any answer: yes or no. I know sometimes when I
 ND> pray I will only want a yes, and that is not right.

 You are absolutely correct.  It is most difficult for any child to
 accept correction.  We also have something in our brain that causes us
 to form a decision almost immediately then filter evidence so that we
 pick and choose the things that confirm our prior decision or block out
 things that contradict that decision.  I can only conclude that being
 God is not easy.

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Date       04-22-92 19:36:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Nick Diprima
Subject      How can 3 be 1??!

 ND> Yes Terry, the Prophet Joseph Smith did see Jesus Christ and God
 ND> his Father standing together. But what does that have to do with
 ND> Jesus Christ being Jehovah?

 Hummm?  I'm simply too confused to ask a question.  I suppose I never
 thought of Jehovah being anyone rather than God the Father.  Are we
 expanding the trinity to include a 4 th party?    That is called the
 4 position foundation in the divine principle.  But there is just one
 God right here \
                  \
                   ------ God the Father
                       /                 \
                    Jesus      and      Holy Spirit----
                               or                     |
                   Christ      and        Bride ----- |
                               or                   | |
               True Father     and      True Mother | |
               |                                    | |
               |     \                   /          | |
               |            Christians    ----------|--
               |         sinless children -----------
               |----------- True Family

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Date       04-22-92 19:49:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Ronald Kinietz
Subject    QUALIFICATION TO TO B

 RK> TB> Well it is strange that two people can have such an opposite
 RK> opinion TB> about someone.  Either Rev. Moon is of God or of the
 RK> devil.  I can TB> remember the last time people were so divided.
 RK>
 RK> The people were DECIEVED, there is big difference.

 Yes they were... they clearly thought Jesus was the devil himself...
 same opinion they now have of Rev. Moon.

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Date       04-22-92 20:12:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Ronald Kinietz
Subject    Rev Moon?

 RK> I would say that if I saw Jesus, which I have not, but have had
 RK> two dreams or visions myself...I would do what ever Jesus
 RK> wanted.

 So you know exactly where I'm coming from. I too have had spiritual
 experiences that confirmed that I should support Rev. Moon.  I know you
 are much more prepared for the mission I have been trying to fill, but
 just as in Jesus' day, it was simple people like myself who could
 recognize the heart of God was living in this man who everyone was
 suspicious of to the point the weren't satisfied until he was dead.
 History has repeated itself.  The first shall be last.  I'm seeing it
 now.  The hippies like myself who though little about God and morality
 in the 60's have been the ones to find the stone the builders have
 rejected. ...while the people God has prepared to build the kingdom
 won't offer a simple prayer to ask God what they should do in response
 to the message Rev. Moon has delivered. Clearly the meaning of being as
 a child is to be open minded.  That is a prerequsit to enter the kingdom
 of heaven.  Matt 18:3   Will you pray about Rev. Moon and the revelation
 he claims to have had from Jesus?   You can ask Jesus if he did appear
 to Rev. Moon. You can ask Jesus if he came to establish the kingdom of
 God on earth 2,000 years ago through the establishment of an ideal
 family.  Ask Jesus if he should have married and given God grand
 children.  If you can understand that one point about establishing the
 God centered family and giving God grandchildren, you can easily
 understand Rev. Moon's teachings.  It is that simple.

 RK> But if someone came to me claiming that Jesus told me to
 RK> tell you...I would run so fast out of there it isn't funny.

 Have you run from St. Paul's writings?

 ROM 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus
 Christ according to my gospel.

 RK> These are wonderful times to be living in, We are all going to
 RK> get to see the Lord Jesus Christ, not hung on a cross, IN
 RK> VICTORY! Everyone will get to see Heaven, even walk the streets,
 RK> but not all will be able to stay and be forever with the Lord. I
 RK> pray that I am worthy to escape all these things that soon must
 RK> shortly come to pass. I am not going to try and throw a
 RK> stumbling block before you.

 You truly have a good heart.  Your ancestorial lineage is a righteous
 one.  Those people in your lineage would surely like to see you succeed.
 If I had one guess, I would say that with all their heart they want you
 to pray about the matters I have mentioned in this message.

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Date       04-22-92 20:54:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Ronald Kinietz
Subject    The Cross

 RK> supplies all my needs just fine. The rest of things that you are
 RK> discussing is purely just superstition, and is against the word
 RK> of God.

 You are wasting your time.  Lord Loki means "Lord of Disaster"
 ...misfortune, calamity, havoc, destruction, etc.
 This person is a not supporting anything good.

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Date       04-23-92 08:22:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Steven Headley
Subject    ANTICHRIST

 SH>   This one is easy - Paul didn't use the better definition.  The
 SH> term   "antichrist," (Greek "antichristos") appears only 4 times
 SH> in the   Bible - 1 John 2:18, 1 John 2:22, 2 John 2:7, 1 John
 SH> 4:3.  Paul   didn't write 1 John or 2 John - JOHN DID.  (Bet
 SH> that comes as a   revelation, huh?)
 SH>
 SH>   Are you now saying that Paul wrote the epistles of John??

 I knew that Paul didn't write John, but you did teach me something.  I
 stand corrected.  I thought Paul had used the term "antichrist."

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Date       04-23-92 08:27:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    God Told Me

 WC>     It was another Jesus that appeared. God does not contradict
 WC> Himself. Neither does He lie. You have already told us that
 WC> Jesus lied to the Rev. Moon and after further questioning
 WC> admitted that He lied.

 I tried to explain that the 3 times Peter denied Christ were being
 restored when Jesus denied Rev. Moon.  But, you did not come to this
 conference to learn.  When you want to learn then I can help you.  You
 eventually need to understand the course of restoration is the reverse
 way.  If you go down a wrong road, you have to turn around and go back
 to the point where you made the mistake.  That course on the way back is
 called indemnity.  Christians have this mistaken thinking that they can
 get back to God without paying indemnity.  I suppose when you understand
 this you can understand why the Messiah must come as a man and establish
 God's ideal family.

 WC> TB> That's nice but where do you stand on the issue of MURDERING
 WC> him.
 WC>     Murder implies that the victim has no choice in the matter.
 WC> Jesus did.

 I know about John 10:19 but if you want to understand my view you will
 consider this:

 MAT 26:39   And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and
 prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from
 me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou [wilt].

 MAT 26:42   He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my
 Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy
 will be done.

 WC>     Only those who insist that the sacrifice of the Cross was
 WC> inade- quate for salvation are the Christ killers of today. They
 WC> attempt to make that sacrifice to no avail and substitute
 WC> another gospel in its place--one which has not power whatsoever.

 How many times have I tried to explain to you that Rev. Moon came not
 for the purpose of salvation, but for the purpose of RESTORATION.  Do
 you understand that after one is saved, the next step is sanctification
 and the establishment of the kingdom of God on earth.  Here is a line I
 hope you NEVER forget:

 Jesus saves and Moon restores.

 What does that mean?  It means that Rev. Moon came to lead fallen man
 back to the point we were before the fall.  If you want to understand,
 you may compare fallen man's situation to that of a person who has
 fallen in to the water.  Fallen man has fallen into the sea of sin.
 Jesus came and was able to throw us a rope or flotation device so that
 we could hang on without going under.  In other words, through Jesus, we
 can keep our heads above the Satanic world but this is not a safe
 situation, nor is it ideal. To get back to our original point and out of
 danger of sin we need to be pulled out and restored back to the position
 were were in before we fell into sin.  That is what Rev. Moon is trying
 to do.  First he had to get himself on firm footing in order to be able
 to pull anyone out of the water.  I know this angers many believers to
 think that he is stand outside our drowning state of sin.  But I am here
 to tell you he is in a position to pull fallen man back to our restored
 state.  You don't have to believe me, you don't have to get upset, but
 you DO have to pray and ask God if I am teaching the truth.

 WC>     There you go again. You condemn me as being a prophet of
 WC> gloom and doom. Then you turn around and cite the same type of
 WC> prophecies.

 I stand corrected.

 WC>     Rather the question was, is and continues to be the
 WC> Scripture contradicting the Divine Principle at almost every
 WC> turn. That is where the problem lies. That is what happens when
 WC> one preaches a different gospel and a different Jesus.

 If you are here to learn, then you may want to consider that those same
 allegations were made against Jesus.   The people accused Jesus of
 violating the gospel of Moses.  Did you know that?  Do you need
 references?

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Date       04-23-92 09:05:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Qualification 1

 WC> See ya,
 WC> Keith

 Why are you signing Walter's messages?  Do I detect a conspiracy? ...or
 have you two formed this Father Son relationship so that you can't be
 distinguished?  ...like the problems some have with Jesus and God?

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Date       04-23-92 09:19:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Walter Copes
Subject    Qualification 2       2/

 WC> TB> Let us humbly listen to the voice of our original mind and
 WC> search TB> for the announcement of the Messiah.
 WC>
 WC>     You can search for the announcement of the Messiah until you
 WC> fall over dead, Terry, but you will never get such an
 WC> announcement from God.
 WC>
 WC> Matthew 24:36  But of that day and hour knoweth no [man], no,
 WC> not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

 AMO 3:7     Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his
 secret unto his servants the prophets.

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Date       04-23-92 09:22:00
From       Terry Blount
To         Steven Headley
Subject    QUALIFICATION TO TO B

 SH>    The test of the messiah is not what the Messiah claims to be,
 SH> but    what God says that he is.  In the case of Moon, God's
 SH> word says that    he is not the Messiah, and therefore is a
 SH> fraud.

 At Jesus' time, Judaism did not recognize the true value of Jesus' the
 Jewish leaders turned their backs on God's Will and the reformation
 which Jesus was teaching and persecuted him.  Likewise, at the Second
 Coming, the new teachings and reformation activities of Christ will be
 opposed by believers who refuse to make the effort to reform
 Christianity, and by the Church, which is attached to its traditional
 authority and rites.

 At Jesus' time, the words of the Messiah were not received by the
 leaders of Judaism.  Rather, they were received by simple lower class
 Jews and Gentiles who were thirsty for spiritual life, or who were
 troubled by their guilty consciences.  Similarly, at the time of the
 Second Coming, laymen who are trying hard to live God's Word, or even
 non-Christians, may be the first to accept the teachings of Christ,
 rather than the leaders of Christianity.  This is why Jesus, in sorrow,
 said that those who would enjoy the marriage feast which he would
 prepare might not be those invited, but those called in at random from
 the street (Mt.22:8-10).

 The people of Jesus' time were born to lead lives of dispensational
 significance, for they were to attend the Messiah and help him to
 realize his will.  They were not ordinary individuals, but had the
 historic responsibility of living at the most important time in
 dispensational history.  Similarly, all people today, and especially
 Christians, have the responsibility to attend the Lord and establish the
 world that realizes the Ideal for the Creation.  We are living at a
 point in time unlike any since the beginning of history.

 At the Second Coming, Christ will proclaim God's Will, which must be
 realized on the earth, and he will educate people to carry it out. True
 people of faith should search for and attend him; and follow God's Will,
 which is revealed through him.  In Matthew 2:3, the Bible says that upon
 hearing of the Messiah's birth, the whole of Jerusalem was in an uproar.
 However, was there any one who cared for Jesus as a baby, or publicly
 supported him after he began his mission?  Let us humbly listen to the
 voice of our original mind and search for the announcement of the
 Messiah.   Let us calm our mind and pay attention to the hope-giving
 news that announces the New Age.